New Interview?
- Thread starter Fedorov
- Start date
RO2 can't be that bad.
Absolutely not.
OFP was a failure of PR, which is something TW doesn't have at the moment, and just the simple fact that the knuckleheads thought they could use listen servers only and satisfy the community.
With RO2 I think everyone is pleased with the game itself and I know I am confident that the gameplay will be everything that I want. Some of us just have issues with standard issue equipment being unlocks, is all.
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RO2 can't be that bad.
I wasn't referring to the quality of OFP: DR, I was referring to the behaviour of the developer and the way they constantly reassured their community.
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I should have been more clear. I meant the situation and the game itself (RO2) won't be nearly as bad as DR. I knew it wouldn't be an ArmA like game despite their marketing. I was hoping for a better GRAW - but the game was so broken and dysfunctional it was a joke.
I was going to pick apart ibleeds post, but Lemon already said what I wanted to. :IS2:
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No sir, both of these have been confirmed in the video in the OP by a Tripwire developer.Red Orchestra 2 Heroes of Stalingrad - YouTube
At 8 minutes 6 seconds and 8 minutes 15 seconds.
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I think most people are afraid of another major disappointment. I remember that I was really excited about Mafia 2 for six years, reading every article about it, watching every video released, and got really disappointed when I put my hands on it. So many games have been ending up like that recently, and some people here are afraid the same could happen to RO2, especially after knowing about some recent facts about the game that might take away part of the experience we've had with ROOST. I still trust in TWI, but I also hope they still listen to their fanbase.
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Can't wait for a patch to fix all this ****.
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It should have. It would have been a better game
It isn't cute nor is it fun for anyone outside these forums to come here and post.
You guys always have to be the smartest ones in the room and that's what will prevent some sales that could have been made.
Picking apart posts is what you have lived on for too long.
STFW if the game isn't EVERTHING you wanted it to be.
Spoiled brats.
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What can I say that hasn't been said before?
I've always been against unlocks in this game, because of the reasons that are nicely explained by VariousNames above, but I always thought we could make certain compromises so the game can expand and sell more, to help Tripwire make bigger and better projects in the future. I just had all my faith and trust in TWI.
But lately, certain lines have been crossed, lines that I never thought TWI would be capable of crossing. Now I just feel that I've being naive and that the trust I had in TWI has been betrayed.
Is there really any justification for it? Unlocks or cartoony English will not bring in new people, and the fact that is not optional makes me wonder how many options will we really have.
The audience you are trying to bring in are, above all, graphic whores, and if you can't get that part right then there is no amount of gimmicky features you can do to your game to make them stop saying that the game looks like ****.
I used to be optimistic that they could be converted, but the reports and the evidence convinced me of the opposite.
And I'm not talking about the shaky cam vids, I'm talking about people who are in the beta, people who trash-talk you and your game behind your backs, those are your new "friends" and it just saddens me to see how you are licking their boots and push us aside.
Trying to change your faithful community, to that abstract audience that you don't fully understand, was probably the worst step you could make. You are fooling yourselves if you think those guys you are trying to appeal to will be a substitute for us, because in the end you guys can end up with no community at all.
I've always been against unlocks in this game, because of the reasons that are nicely explained by VariousNames above, but I always thought we could make certain compromises so the game can expand and sell more, to help Tripwire make bigger and better projects in the future. I just had all my faith and trust in TWI.
But lately, certain lines have been crossed, lines that I never thought TWI would be capable of crossing. Now I just feel that I've being naive and that the trust I had in TWI has been betrayed.
Is there really any justification for it? Unlocks or cartoony English will not bring in new people, and the fact that is not optional makes me wonder how many options will we really have.
The audience you are trying to bring in are, above all, graphic whores, and if you can't get that part right then there is no amount of gimmicky features you can do to your game to make them stop saying that the game looks like ****.
I used to be optimistic that they could be converted, but the reports and the evidence convinced me of the opposite.
And I'm not talking about the shaky cam vids, I'm talking about people who are in the beta, people who trash-talk you and your game behind your backs, those are your new "friends" and it just saddens me to see how you are licking their boots and push us aside.
Trying to change your faithful community, to that abstract audience that you don't fully understand, was probably the worst step you could make. You are fooling yourselves if you think those guys you are trying to appeal to will be a substitute for us, because in the end you guys can end up with no community at all.
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If you would've cared enough to read then you would've found out that RO gamers neither want another ArmA2, nor do they view RO as a sim. What you are showing is ignorance, using some kind of impression you have (and multiple people have told you now that it's wrong) in order to "defute" arguments.
RO gamers want RO to be a RO game, NOT ArmA, NOT CoD, NOT BF.
We simply want RO.
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As Lemon said, we don't want a sim. Most RO players do not want a sim. You are conflating wanting the game to stay true to its original style of gameplay with wanting it to be ArmA in the Eastern Front.
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Just want to emphasize--Tripwire has not sold out its fanbase to promote RO2. Saying anything of that sort is both unfair and inaccurate. They've responded very positively to our suggestions on mantling, tank damage modeling, single-round reloading of the bolt-action rifle, machine-gunner mechanics, adjustable sights, inturruptible reloads, ammunition checking, and so much more.
But nothing in this world is perfect, and some ideas that look great on paper, that seem to hold promise, just don't end up working well in practice, and that's nobody's fault.
Accusing them of folly cannot possibly do any good, and might instead discourage the devs from sifting through forum smoke and flame to look for input in the future.
As for the reaction to a few quick words in an interview, it may seem like an overreaction, but isn't it better to voice our concerns now and be proven wrong than to wait only to find out that what we weren't comfortable about reached the final version? True, "innocent until proven guilty" is the law of the land, but the same law holds that if there is a possibility of "guilt", however unproven, an inquiry still takes place.
In response to ibleedv20, LemoN and Chang are exactly correct. We're not arguing about perfect historical accuracy. We're doing our part to make sure RO2's core gameplay is true to that of Ostfront. Bayonets and drum mags played an important role in the gameplay of RO:O alongside ballistics and other mechanics, and we object to the fact that consequentially the RO experience will be altered.
I am also a big fan of the Halo series, which is neither realistic nor simulator-like, and I'm dead certain that the Halo community would react in a very similar way if the energy sword was locked in Halo 4's multiplayer until enough 'experience' had been obtained.
I mean, what do you want personally, ibleed? Wouldn't you, too, rather have access to the bayonet from day one?
And look, what Tripwire is trying to do ISN'T to cater to the mainstream crowd, but to gently CONVERT part of the mainstream crowd so that they too enjoy the unique virtues of Red Orchestra, with a consequentially greater economic profit. There's a difference.
Sure, Tripwire will love bringing some of those "young gamers" onboard, but that doesn't mean they will bow down and grovel to their purchasing power. Quite the opposite--Firefight and Casual realism modes will introduce those young gamers to what they've been missing out on: the thrill of compensating for bullet drop to snipe an enemy across the map for the first time, the adrenaline rush of realizing you've run out of ammunition face-to-face with the enemy. That is the genius of Tripwire that will make RO:HoS a success.
Look around at the other forum newcomers. Look for the joyful posts of, "Hey, I usually play Modern Warfare but I came across Red Orchestra and now I can't put it down!" "I love this game!" "I love the realism!" People who never thought that realistic elements could work in an FPS pick up Ostfront and realize that they not only work--they improve the game!
I think of myself as one of those people. I joined the RO community in March of this year when I was looking for a shooter besides Halo PC that would meet my computer's system requirements. RO's smart, intelligent gameplay has won me over completely. There are many others on this forum who can attest to the same conversion experience. Ostfront alone in these last few months has converted hundreds as HoS's publicity has soared. The servers are bursting at the seams as newly arrived players exuberantly exclaim, "Hey I just got my first bayonet kill!"
And here's a news flash for you: people DO care about authenticity, which is WHY ROHOS is being made! Tripwire was founded by realism nuts--have you seen Wilsonam's WWII reading suggestion list? Or did you think the 1:1 scale RO2 maps based on actual real-world locations were just marketing gimmicks?
In the Markeedragon interview, Gibson himself says, "Nobody was making a WW2 game--well actually, nobody was making a shooter that played the way we wanted it to play. Nobody was doing the authenticity, the level of detail, the realism that we wanted in a game that we wanted to play." That's a direct quote. News flash for you, bud--games like that ARE being made!
But I'm getting off-topic. In short, there is a lot of forum drama going on lately, and I hope somebody with decision-making power can look past the occasionally hysterical posts and see the basis for our concerns.
But nothing in this world is perfect, and some ideas that look great on paper, that seem to hold promise, just don't end up working well in practice, and that's nobody's fault.
Accusing them of folly cannot possibly do any good, and might instead discourage the devs from sifting through forum smoke and flame to look for input in the future.
As for the reaction to a few quick words in an interview, it may seem like an overreaction, but isn't it better to voice our concerns now and be proven wrong than to wait only to find out that what we weren't comfortable about reached the final version? True, "innocent until proven guilty" is the law of the land, but the same law holds that if there is a possibility of "guilt", however unproven, an inquiry still takes place.
In response to ibleedv20, LemoN and Chang are exactly correct. We're not arguing about perfect historical accuracy. We're doing our part to make sure RO2's core gameplay is true to that of Ostfront. Bayonets and drum mags played an important role in the gameplay of RO:O alongside ballistics and other mechanics, and we object to the fact that consequentially the RO experience will be altered.
I am also a big fan of the Halo series, which is neither realistic nor simulator-like, and I'm dead certain that the Halo community would react in a very similar way if the energy sword was locked in Halo 4's multiplayer until enough 'experience' had been obtained.
I mean, what do you want personally, ibleed? Wouldn't you, too, rather have access to the bayonet from day one?
And look, what Tripwire is trying to do ISN'T to cater to the mainstream crowd, but to gently CONVERT part of the mainstream crowd so that they too enjoy the unique virtues of Red Orchestra, with a consequentially greater economic profit. There's a difference.
Sure, Tripwire will love bringing some of those "young gamers" onboard, but that doesn't mean they will bow down and grovel to their purchasing power. Quite the opposite--Firefight and Casual realism modes will introduce those young gamers to what they've been missing out on: the thrill of compensating for bullet drop to snipe an enemy across the map for the first time, the adrenaline rush of realizing you've run out of ammunition face-to-face with the enemy. That is the genius of Tripwire that will make RO:HoS a success.
Look around at the other forum newcomers. Look for the joyful posts of, "Hey, I usually play Modern Warfare but I came across Red Orchestra and now I can't put it down!" "I love this game!" "I love the realism!" People who never thought that realistic elements could work in an FPS pick up Ostfront and realize that they not only work--they improve the game!
I think of myself as one of those people. I joined the RO community in March of this year when I was looking for a shooter besides Halo PC that would meet my computer's system requirements. RO's smart, intelligent gameplay has won me over completely. There are many others on this forum who can attest to the same conversion experience. Ostfront alone in these last few months has converted hundreds as HoS's publicity has soared. The servers are bursting at the seams as newly arrived players exuberantly exclaim, "Hey I just got my first bayonet kill!"
And here's a news flash for you: people DO care about authenticity, which is WHY ROHOS is being made! Tripwire was founded by realism nuts--have you seen Wilsonam's WWII reading suggestion list? Or did you think the 1:1 scale RO2 maps based on actual real-world locations were just marketing gimmicks?
In the Markeedragon interview, Gibson himself says, "Nobody was making a WW2 game--well actually, nobody was making a shooter that played the way we wanted it to play. Nobody was doing the authenticity, the level of detail, the realism that we wanted in a game that we wanted to play." That's a direct quote. News flash for you, bud--games like that ARE being made!
But I'm getting off-topic. In short, there is a lot of forum drama going on lately, and I hope somebody with decision-making power can look past the occasionally hysterical posts and see the basis for our concerns.
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Im not against unlocks but truth is a really good game needs no unlocks to keep people playing. ROOST, PR & FH2 are good examples, people play them because theyre good and fun, and not to get the next item and quit.
While unlocks overall arent bad and can make a supah duper epic game even more fun at start, making every tiny rivet, bolt and w/e unlockable is silly.. Like DICE did in BC2 with vehicle perks/unlocks, stripping away stuff that tanks should have by default and making people choose between mandatory stuff like coaxial MG and smoke.
While unlocks overall arent bad and can make a supah duper epic game even more fun at start, making every tiny rivet, bolt and w/e unlockable is silly.. Like DICE did in BC2 with vehicle perks/unlocks, stripping away stuff that tanks should have by default and making people choose between mandatory stuff like coaxial MG and smoke.
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Nice found OP I really like how the game is forming up.
About unlocks
People are always saying for example, that unlocks should be their avatar is shooting his rifle a lot and gets used to it and therefore he gets a lower recoil. But what happens when the soildier dies? ( you die one time in the game ) Shouldn't you be losing your unlock then?
About the bayonet part, It might be bad that it turned out to be an unlock but that doesn't make the game bad overall. Do like me, just pretend you are one of the unlucky soldiers who didn't get a bayonet because of the low supplies, while you watch your other teamates have the bayo and think, "Crap I didn't get the bayo" And just feel the unfairness of war. (DON'T PANIC! you'll get it anyway just not in the start. )
I mean have you never seen Enemy at the gates when they are storming the germans with just a rifle (without bayo ) and no ammo, or ammo without the rifle...
Anyway if anyone got offended by my post I didn't mean it
Oh, and don't forget :IS2:
I really like how the game is forming up.About unlocks
People are always saying for example, that unlocks should be their avatar is shooting his rifle a lot and gets used to it and therefore he gets a lower recoil. But what happens when the soildier dies? ( you die one time in the game ) Shouldn't you be losing your unlock then?
About the bayonet part, It might be bad that it turned out to be an unlock but that doesn't make the game bad overall. Do like me, just pretend you are one of the unlucky soldiers who didn't get a bayonet because of the low supplies, while you watch your other teamates have the bayo and think, "Crap I didn't get the bayo" And just feel the unfairness of war.
(DON'T PANIC! you'll get it anyway just not in the start. )I mean have you never seen Enemy at the gates when they are storming the germans with just a rifle (without bayo ) and no ammo, or ammo without the rifle...
Anyway if anyone got offended by my post I didn't mean it
Oh, and don't forget :IS2:
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None of it bothers me.
Tripwire listens to their fanbase, and if enough of you whine they will probably change things like your precious bayonets being unlocks. How many bayonet kills do you get in 1 match anyway? Less than 10? Less than 5? An average of 0-1? You'll survive, believe me.
And once you do unlock the bayonets, you won't care about it anymore.
I'm just glad Tripwire is at least attempting to do something new and potentially represent the various forms of combat in war. Like it or not, there were troops who may have entered combat without their bayonets fixed, even though they had one available to them. Same as there may have been troops who wore their uniform a bit differently, or used captured weapons. None of these things are outside the realm of plausibility.
It could be that I'm just sick of playing WW2 shooters where everyone is an exact carbon copy of each other, carrying the same exact kit and wearing perfectly kept uniforms with polished boots and well oiled weapons. That's a reenactor's fantasy. I want to get the rest of the picture, and these unlocks help with that. Players won't be drastically different but they will have some "breathing room" with options based on real-world equipment and some extra bonuses based on veteran status.
I just have to say it really bothers me that some long-time supporters of the game and the devs are suddenly questioning EVERYTHING because of some silly unlock. Don't let such trivial things ruin a potential GOTY.
Tripwire listens to their fanbase, and if enough of you whine they will probably change things like your precious bayonets being unlocks. How many bayonet kills do you get in 1 match anyway? Less than 10? Less than 5? An average of 0-1? You'll survive, believe me.
And once you do unlock the bayonets, you won't care about it anymore.
I'm just glad Tripwire is at least attempting to do something new and potentially represent the various forms of combat in war. Like it or not, there were troops who may have entered combat without their bayonets fixed, even though they had one available to them. Same as there may have been troops who wore their uniform a bit differently, or used captured weapons. None of these things are outside the realm of plausibility.
It could be that I'm just sick of playing WW2 shooters where everyone is an exact carbon copy of each other, carrying the same exact kit and wearing perfectly kept uniforms with polished boots and well oiled weapons. That's a reenactor's fantasy. I want to get the rest of the picture, and these unlocks help with that. Players won't be drastically different but they will have some "breathing room" with options based on real-world equipment and some extra bonuses based on veteran status.
I just have to say it really bothers me that some long-time supporters of the game and the devs are suddenly questioning EVERYTHING because of some silly unlock. Don't let such trivial things ruin a potential GOTY.
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http://pcgamingtips.blogspot.com/2011/07/i-dont-believe-hype.html
Just some random blog, but he has a lot of good points.
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i noticed the author's name too......but i don't judge content just by the "reputation" of the author. i look at the validity of the words written......and honestly, he's got some very good points.
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