Not having a basic crosshair option might be alienating casual players.

[OmniXVII]

If you are a veteran KF player here to disagree with the addition of a basic crosshair, please read my post below before doing so.

Why do you care so much about a stupid crosshair?

For something so simple, I believe the discussion of crosshairs is very important for a FPS game. The entire game and skill required playing the revolves entirely around the small little spot on the center of the screen where all your shots will land. FPS games could really be called "Line up the mouse with the target, the video game," and crosshairs have been an integral part of almost all FPS games since forever. For the casual playerbase, they've probably been aiming with the assistance of a crosshair at all times in any FPS they've played.

I believe it is important to have a basic ingame crosshair for players who need it so that we don't lose out on any potential playerbase simply because of a design choice. Catering to your veterans with design choices is smart, but alienating anyone else who will make up the majority of your playerbase in the process isn't. Having more options is always good. Having less options is always bad.

But there already is a 'Show Crosshair' option in the game menu!

The current crosshair we have in the game options is way too big to be even remotely useful for a lot of players. Not to mention it expands with recoil and sprinting, making it completely useless for aiming with. The ingame flashlight is a more useful crosshair than the actual crosshair option itself. If the lines of crosshair were thicker, it would make it a little better, but as of now it's way easy to lose track of the center when it's bright or chaotic.

The lack of a crosshair was a game design choice.

This might be the most compelling argument to not have a crosshair. So let me use my friends who tried playing this game as an example for something I'm about to explain: There's a good chance KF2 alienates a lot of casual shooters just because they feel like they are bad at aiming, when in reality they could be doing just fine if they simply had a suitable crosshair.

This is just a theory I have with no way of proving, but let me try and explain why I think this. The 5 friends I introduced to the game who all have FPS experience, all gave up playing because they said "I suck at shooting in this game," or "I'm bad at aiming." When in actuality, there's a good chance that the lack of a decent in-game crosshair is punishing players who have relied on them in the past. Not once did they say: "The game isn't fun."

Players do not want to continue playing a game that they perform terribly in without seeing improvement in. Having a visible benchmark in which they can focus on improving (such as lining up crosshairs) is important so they can feel like there is a way to improve, versus just shooting wildly towards the center of a blank screen. Even when I play on easier difficulties with them, I feel like they get frustrated that they are unable to headshot slower moving targets on their first attempt, then they get bored before getting skilled enough to try Suicidal which is where the real fun begins.

Just use a crosshair overlay if you want it so badly!

Oh I am, trust me. I wouldn't have gotten this far into the game without it. Without a crosshair I can barely scrape past Suicidal just relying on spraying and praying. With an overlay, I can play on HoE like a breeze. The difference crosshairs give my shooting performance is jaw-dropping, and i highly recommend to anyone struggling with aiming to try an overlay. I feel like this applies to most players as well.

Then what is the problem if you can just use an overlay to get your crosshair?

There are a lot of problems with using an overlay as a crosshair. Firstly, no casual shooter will go through the huge pile of ****ty programs like I did to just to have a basic crosshair.

Secondly, the overlay doesn't magically disappear when you use a weapon scope or iron sights, and that is what causes the biggest problems:

1. The crosshair gets in the way of scopes and laser dots, making it difficult to shoot while the dot sways back and forth in front of the overlay.
2. Most scopes and laser dots are in a DIFFERENT SPOT compared to firing from the hip for some reason.
3. The overlay is always on the screen, regardless if you want to alt-tab quickly, take a screenshot, or watch a video.

This is the second biggest reason why I think an ingame crosshair is needed. I've been playing for hundreds of hours using a crosshair overlay while always firing from the hip because using a scope means my crosshair overlay will get in the way.


So in conclusion, I feel like a simple crosshair option would benefit the game greatly more than it would harm it. Players who want to play without a crosshair can continue to do so, while more casual players can use the assistance of a crosshair to help aid their aim. I really enjoy this game, and I would like it to continue doing well and for Tripwire to be successful from it. Any players we can hold onto will help keep the game alive for as long as possible.

 

[Reclusiarch]

Quake 1 didn't have crosshairs neither and was (and still is) one of the top FPSs ever, so I don't believe that the lack of crosshair would repel more casual players.
Still, it wouldn't hurt to add a more functional one: if you don't need it, don't use it, and vice-versa.

 

[TheAphabet]

KF1 did really really well without the cross hair option, so I do not see why KF2 needs to buck that trend. The entire point of not implementing a cross hair, I believe, is to increase the immersion while creating a risk-reward situation.

Simply put: you are encouraged to use the iron scopes when taking precision shots, but in doing so, your movement speed is penalized. That is how the game have always been played.

 

[Utopia-Phoenix]

Any pictures of the crosshair you wished? I read it. I reminded that in an online game known as Crossfire (2008, Neowiz), there are 3 types of crosshairs.
#1 Distant crosshair, without center dot
#2 Distant crosshair, WITH center dot
#3 Circle, with center dot

Note that Crossfire does NOT have ADS options, the crosshair is the ONLY aim method to them.
Among the assessments of the players, the 3rd crosshair is most favorable in novices. (And mostly chosen among all) The 2nd crosshair is preferable to intermediates. The 1st crosshair is the least favorable among all, but it's the DEFAULT option! I prefer the 2nd crosshair in that game.

As with the case in KF2, I enabled the crosshair. I'm a commando and sometimes I need to use hipfire, especially on AR15. The essence of hipfire AR15 headshotting distant targets is to keep your muzzle at POSSIBLE enemy head height (HORIZONTAL crosshair alignment with enemy head) REGARDLESS of presence of enemies. When enemies appear, keep horizontal height unchanged but aim your VERTICAL crosshair at enemy head. Horizontal aimed+vertical aimed= headshot.
As with the circular crosshair, I understand the novices. They involve the enemy heads into the circle and fire REGARDLESS of X and Y coordinates.

Bringing more crosshairs to KF2 can be a good idea, but at least you need to bring a PICTURE of it to be effective!

 

[pie1055]

I understand where you're coming from and I hope they address this issue for you, but I don't think you're going to see a lot of people agreeing with you on these forums about using crosshairs. Not every game has them and Killing Floor certainly wasn't the first shooter to do without them. Making Killing Floor be more accessible is usually a good idea though so I think this is good feedback nonetheless, especially on a feature most of us vocal players probably go without.

If you're willing, a few tips for dealing with bad/no crosshairs;

• Use ADS if you have the time.
• Observe where initial shots go and adjust for follow-ups.
• Plink at walls to get a better feel for where bullets will go, practicing in non-stressful environments makes a big difference.
• In addendum to the previous point, try practicing hipfiring at map collectibles. They're the perfect non-stressful targets.
• If all else fails, unload a little more than you usually would and buy ammo more often than new guns. One of your shots should hit =d

You do develop a feel for it over time and one of the most satisfying parts about this game is seeing a zed walk around the corner and thinking to yourself, "I bet I can pivot and headshot that zed before my teammates notice it." before doing just that. You start challenging yourself and I at least have fun doing so. It's really something to show this game to a friend who is completely bewildered at how you just took out 7 enemies with 6 shots as fast as the gun will let you empty it (Hint: bullet penetration).

 

[imnrk]

Well I'm the definition of a casual player, and I prefer the game with no crosshair.

 

[oldmidget]

maybe add it to PS4 because they are all terrible.

PC dont need that ****, every gun has tracers and thats really good enough. crosshairs are so ugly nothing but a distraction, thank god CS:S taught me how know where the center of my screen is due to scout overusage.

adding a more accurate crosshair undermines some weapons, like the M39 EBR with its laser dot. and evicerator with its horrible laser dot.

 

[s5yn3t]

So much bias towards no crosshairs as if this game is made to be insurgency with "zombies"..... No crosshairs, is bad for your
​​​​ health. Don't want crosshairs turn it off and fck off the thread that doesn't target you.

​​​​​​IMO the crosshair that comes with the game is good but need sliders for thickness, size and spacing. Because currently for my personal taste the spacing is too wide (but it differs for everyone because of the different resolutions)

What really needs fckin removal from the game is boss health bar. Breaks immersion and forces everyone to attack boss at any cost without any afterthought of should i keep trash away so teammates could focus on boss more.
It can be disabled but thats too big of an advantage to just turn it off.

 

[TheTCREngineer]

So much bias towards no crosshairs as if this game is made to be insurgency with "zombies"..... No crosshairs, is bad for your
​​​​ health. Don't want crosshairs turn it off and fck off the thread that doesn't target you.

What really needs fckin removal from the game is boss health bar
It can be disabled but thats too big of an advantage to just turn it off.

...That's really hypocritical, especially for two problems that can be disabled easily and doesn't affect you in anyway.

 

[s5yn3t]

...That's really hypocritical, especially for two problems that can be disabled easily and doesn't affect you in anyway.

because crosshairs are a minor thing that doesn't affect game or experience.

Global boss healthbar is major as you no longer have that fear of fighting the boss and wondering how much health he has (if you played early months of EA you'd know)

Now its enabled globally for everyone the fear is no longer present, the cordinations no longer required as just everyone goes in blindly because people (in a pre made squad cordination is different) but for everyday game in pugs that ruins the whole boss battle experience and disabling it for yourself will not change anything.

 

[PurpleFanta]

I think crosshairs should be allowed in normal, like full on crosshairs. But I really dont like when games dumb the core gameplay down for more players to join in. I had forgotten how much fun the bloodrush of suicidal+ is in this game.

Another thing that would help would be adding beginner mode, which current normal mode should be (or maybe slightly easier) and add a mode in between beginner and hard to help space out difficulty a little more. There's a huge spike between each difficulty right now and I think it kind of hurts the game for newer players. Normal is mind numbingly easy, hard is a good challenge for newer players, but I still know people that struggle in hard but think normal is too easy. Then hard to Suicidal is a huge leap in difficulty.

Changing normal to beginner and having a somewhere inbetween current normal and hard would also allow hard to add on some more mechanics from suicidal like slightly more common albino zeds just so you get used to dealing with them.

 

[TheAphabet]

Another thing that would help would be adding beginner mode, which current normal mode should be (or maybe slightly easier) and add a mode in between beginner and hard to help space out difficulty a little more. There's a huge spike between each difficulty right now and I think it kind of hurts the game for newer players. Normal is mind numbingly easy, hard is a good challenge for newer players, but I still know people that struggle in hard but think normal is too easy. Then hard to Suicidal is a huge leap in difficulty.

Along those lines, I still think a full crosshair should not be added into regular gameplay. What I would suggest over that is a sandbox/training mode with a crosshair instead, on a shooting-range map, and perk EXP disabled.

 

[mrnok14l]

Just pointing out a few things.

1. There is a optional crosshair under 'gameplay' settings, which is disabled by default.

2. The reason of such implementation is no different than other optional settings, to improve gameplay experience on one end or the other.

3. As the aim-point is fixed at the screen center to be coaxial with the camera, this game isn't that much into concept of realism to squash the demand in the first place. In other words, the crosshair we currently have is nothing more than a reminder to prevent disorientation.

 

[PurpleFanta]

Just pointing out a few things.

1. There is a optional crosshair under 'gameplay' settings, which is disabled by default.

2. The reason of such implementation is no different than other optional settings, to improve gameplay experience on one end or the other.

3. As the aim-point is fixed at the screen center to be coaxial with the camera, this game isn't that much into concept of realism to squash the demand in the first place. In other words, the crosshair we currently have is nothing more than a reminder to prevent disorientation.

What they meant was an easier crosshair, If memory serves the one in the game is kind of so you know generally where you're aiming not one that shows specifically where you'd hit. I still think i'd be fine with normal having a more precise crosshair so that people can get more used to aiming and whatnot. I know this game really is hard when you're new to it.

 

[Pavlov's Dog]

What's wrong with the existing crosshair? The fact that it isn't dead-center? Fair enough, but if you're playing a game like Killing Floor, you likely aren't in it for easymode playtime. Additional crosshair options would be nice, but I don't see why most (if not all) players would get along just fine with the existing crosshairs. Also, I'd want to see a streamlined/improved/expanded taunt system before additional crosshair options. There are a few other things I'd consider to be higher up the list of priorities.

 

[Arcames]

KF2 shouldn't have crosshairs at all.

I play a wide variety of games with crossairs but I don't feel the need to use them in KF1 or KF2. Hit M2 and use the gun's crosshair.

 

[Quadruplesword]

Not that I, personally (so I don't speak for everyone), would use the crosshair option since after 300 hours of KF1 having one just feels weird, but the default crosshair just looks ugly in my opinion. The crosshair itself is way too thin and gets lost easily in hectic battles, and the growing/shrinking with weapon spread I feel is a bit unnecessary. To be honest, I probably would commit Killing Floor heresy and enable the crosshair if I could just have a simple dot that denoted where the center of the screen is. As it is, I find the crosshair actually hurts my aim more than helps it. Basically, I'm saying if there's going to be an option for a crosshair in game, we should have more customization options.

 

[silverlighted]

Oh I am, trust me. I wouldn't have gotten this far into the game without it. Without a crosshair I can barely scrape past Suicidal just relying on spraying and praying. With an overlay, I can play on HoE like a breeze. The difference crosshairs give my shooting performance is jaw-dropping, and i highly recommend to anyone struggling with aiming to try an overlay. I feel like this applies to most players as well.

There are a lot of problems with using an overlay as a crosshair. Firstly, no casual shooter will go through the huge pile of ****ty programs like I did to just to have a basic crosshair.

No casual gamer is going to play on HOE.

With that said, I agree that the default crosshair IS awful.

 

[TheAphabet]

Thanks for being a perfect example of elitism in a video games. This is the kind of attitude that kills off niche games like KF2 by intentionally excluding other communities.

Well, he/she ain't wrong, ADS is the one sure way of landing precise shots, and hip fire is usually for mid to close range firing. Point is, a lack of crosshair never impeded KF1, and it won't impede KF2 as long as they are both fun as hell.

 

[ComradeHX]

Fortunately it's not up to you to decide who belongs in KF.

Fortunately it's not up to you to decide what feature is proper for KF2, just like damage of tier 4 weapons.

Such a lovely man-baby, truly the best of the best!

You are just as irrelevant as your boyfriend above.

Thanks for being a perfect example of elitism in a video games. This is the kind of attitude that kills off niche games like KF2 by intentionally excluding other communities.

It's not Elitism, it's called respecting a proper game design.

There is a reason full movespeed while ADS is a skill...
There is supposed to be a trade-off between accurate firing and full movement speed, except for when using SWAT/Gunslinger with appropriate skill.
Same reason why drawing a dot in center of screen is considered cheating.


You can't deflect anything with accusation of elitism.

KF2 is casual as **** already, the crosshair is no worse than COD ones(which is about as casual as FPS can get).
I find it hilarious how you think adding a more precise crosshair will get people to play KF2 when KF2 already plays like COD-player's wet dream(quickscopes).

The real reason people miss shots in close range is the fact that guns can shoot above where center of screen is, that's like CSGO and nothing "elite" to be able to notice. All that panic shooting means a little crosshair won't help, at all.