[Error] Of Tanks and the RED SCREENS

[Mike_Nomad]

I posted this in hopes of drawing attention to a pair of obvious problems;

Sadly, because of a few serious situations recently having developed, RGN is regretfully considering the removal of all tank maps. An unusual amount of player complaints relating to the more than obvious weakening of the PZ4 tank and new herculean properties of the T34 tank has many of our players voicing their unhappy impressions.

RGN politely requests that TWI re-examine the properties of both these tanks as there seems to be noticeable inequities present.

Additionally, the recent appearance of the RED SCREEN "Out of Combat Zone" repeatedly interrupting gameplay on BOTH the popular Custom Maps and Stock maps is becoming more than a casual annoyance. Please address this annoying anomaly as soon as possible.

[Cwivey]

Originally Posted by 23rd May Change History page

• General Tank Changes
  • Made damage and armor tweaks with the T34 to get it more in balance with the Panzer IV. A battle between the two tanks should now be a much more even fight, while still retaining their realistic strengths and weaknesses.
  • T34 – gun mantlet changed to account for the heavily curved shape, also improving its resistance
  • Fixed a bug with the Panzer for main cannon mantlet that essentially prevented rounds from penetrating it at any range

Both tanks have been made to act somewhat more realistically, the sloped armour of the T34 was effective! Either tank can be pretty much dead-meat from close range now, rather than the T34 shooting range that it once was.

[Mike_Nomad]

Originally Posted by Cwivey

Both tanks have been made to act somewhat more realistically, the sloped armour of the T34 was effective! Either tank can be pretty much dead-meat from close range now, rather than the T34 shooting range that it once was.

Realistically?? REALLY?

Unfortunately, its a role reversal - the PZ4 is now a two shot kill. Unless you shoot the T34 broadside or in the rear, its damn near invincible.

1st shot to the PZ4 frontally results in armor damage, transmission damage, turret damage, turret ring damage and turret gunner dead... 2cnd shot tank is done.

Sorry but that just ain't right.

I'm not going to argue the point..... play the game and see for yourself. The PZ4 is a wimp now.

[r5cya]

in the case of tanks, i'm in favor of scrapping the whole idea of realism. i think they should both have the same destrucability. neither stronger than the other and neither gun more powerful than the other. let the tankers skills decide who wins. not the vehicle.

[eM*]

Hi Mike, I have to agree with you. I guess I used Panzer few times after that "balance crap patch" and Panzer is a paper tank now. I hit couple times Russian "junk", and did nothing to it, while my tank got hit fewer hits, and it exploded.

r5cya, play other game. Get the hell out of here, of RO.

Realism is the most important thing.

[RiccardoTheBeAst]

Originally Posted by 23rd May Change History page

• General Tank Changes
  • Made damage and armor tweaks with the T34 to get it more in balance with the Panzer IV. A battle between the two tanks should now be a much more even fight, while still retaining their realistic strengths and weaknesses.
  • T34 – gun mantlet changed to account for the heavily curved shape, also improving its resistance
  • Fixed a bug with the Panzer for main cannon mantlet that essentially prevented rounds from penetrating it at any range

I do not understand the first point. "Balance"? I mean, DH tank maps are amazing to play and even if the Allied armor usually are inferior to the Axis armor the different tactics, the players skills, the terrain properties etc balance themself the match even if the equipment is highly unbalanced.

[Major_Day]

Originally Posted by Mike_Nomad

I posted this in hopes of drawing attention to a pair of obvious problems;

Sadly, because of a few serious situations recently having developed, RGN is regretfully considering the removal of all tank maps. An unusual amount of player complaints relating to the more than obvious weakening of the PZ4 tank and new herculean properties of the T34 tank has many of our players voicing their unhappy impressions.

RGN politely requests that TWI re-examine the properties of both these tanks as there seems to be noticeable inequities present.

Additionally, the recent appearance of the RED SCREEN "Out of Combat Zone" repeatedly interrupting gameplay on BOTH the popular Custom Maps and Stock maps is becoming more than a casual annoyance. Please address this annoying anomaly as soon as possible.

+1 Thanks for posting this Mike, i thought it was just me who thought this,i reckoned that the Allied tankers were just getting better and that it wasn't likely that TWI had buggered up the Panzer.when they made changes to the T34
It seems that not only is the T34 harder to kill,but the Panzer is now easier to kill than it was before.

Tanks should also be given MUCH MORE TIME to get back into, not only the combat zone,but out of a newly opened up spawn zone.

I wouldn't go so far as removing the tank maps from the server,but i do think that something has to be done to restore the imbalance created since the last update. The pendulum has swing from Axis side to Allied side, instead of steadying in the middle.

[r5cya]

Originally Posted by eM*

Hi Mike, I have to agree with you. I guess I used Panzer few times after that "balance crap patch" and Panzer is a paper tank now. I hit couple times Russian "junk", and did nothing to it, while my tank got hit fewer hits, and it exploded.

r5cya, play other game. Get the hell out of here, of RO.

Realism is the most important thing.

so, you got owned and want it back the way it was? LOL! you just want a stronger tank than the enemy? that figures.
p.s. nice edit job. it still shows you have no class though. maybe it's you that should leave.

[eM*]

Yah edited, because mod found it inappropriate. It was **** anyway. Im not used to such strict rules. I usually post on forums, that dont seem to point every single mistake.

You keep ... "I dont like it, get rid of it". Go play CoD for example, arcade fps with no realism at all, so you wont be complaining.

[Klaus Stamper]

I agree with eM* here, the whole point of the game is to replicate the situations back in the war. Not provide a happy balance for everyone to adhere to, to make it "fair" because the war wasnt fair.
It leaves it up to the player to rethink the strategy, and find ways to blow up the tank. It requires a little more intelligence and class than just firing at a shape and then boom, the tank is gone. The first game did it well, pretty much each tank was how it was in the war, and nobody was really complaining by the time the game was adequately patched.
The game (HoS) has been really over balanced in my opinion, especially in the tank areas, and the "nerfing" of the German weapons,in favour of the Russian equality, which in real life was overcome by sheer numbers and different tactics.
The point is to overcome by means of reworking, trial and error and actual outhtinking, not just being on an even footing.

[Ducky]

Originally Posted by eM*

Yah edited, because mod found it inappropriate. It was **** anyway. Im not used to such strict rules. I usually post on forums, that dont seem to point every single mistake.

You keep ... "I dont like it, get rid of it". Go play CoD for example, arcade fps with no realism at all, so you wont be complaining.

Any member on this forum is allowed to speak freely as long as the post is civil and within forum rules.

We should also not forget that every person is allowed to have his own opinion. It's called freedom of speech.

[Mike_Nomad]

Originally Posted by r5cya

so, you got owned and want it back the way it was? LOL! you just want a stronger tank than the enemy? that figures.
p.s. nice edit job. it still shows you have no class though. maybe it's you that should leave.

Back the way it was? Not hardly... The T34 needed beefing up but the PZ4 did NOT need NERFING. Our servers are not killing fields for totally unbalanced tanks. They should've left the PZ4 as it was and strengthened the T34. What we have now is a full blown disaster.

Actually, as I posted...

"1st shot to the PZ4 frontally results in armor damage, transmission damage, turret damage, turret ring damage and turret gunner dead... 2cnd shot tank is done.

Sorry but that just ain't right."

Sums up the results for the PZ4 ...as the T34 now takes 5 or more hits to damage let alone destroy.

As I said, "it just ain't right".

Whomever did the modifying, got carried away and overdid it.

One has to wonder why.. after the tremendous success of tanking in RO it was deemed necessary to change everything. Don't get me wrong, I truly appreciate and enjoy the interiors but that has nothing whatsoever to do with the tank's combat capabilities.

As it stands now, the Panzer 4 is useless against experienced tankers in T34's. Tanking at this point ...is horrible.

[r5cya]

sorry mike, i should not have responded to the em* troll.
i meant back the way it was in ost. it allways seemed to be a one hit kill by the germans then.
i had no problem with ro2 tanks before they changed them, but it's obvious they have a problem now. the last two i killed with a ptr from 150 meters, one shot, proved that. i agree, they should have toughened up the t-34 and left the pz4 alone and tried that out for a while.

[Mike_Nomad]

No need for apologies..... I'm glad you see the need for the tank's combat effectiveness to be adjusted. Yesterday was the key for me I watched 20 players go at it and the average score for the T34 players was 3x that of the PZ4 players. That's simply ridiculous.

[keasy]

Originally Posted by Mike_Nomad

No need for apologies..... I'm glad you see the need for the tank's combat effectiveness to be adjusted. Yesterday was the key for me I watched 20 players go at it and the average score for the T34 players was 3x that of the PZ4 players. That's simply ridiculous.

I was in your server during that game Mike and I too have to agree.
It was just a massacre and regardless of the authenticity RO2 offers there was no way to out think, manoeuvre, outwit the Russian tanks as the balance is tipped far too heavily in their favour.

As I said I'm for the general realism/authentic take of RO2 but the crux of the issue is it is still a game and as such needs tweaked and balanced to make it enjoyable.

P.S. As a Scott it was funny listening to you complain in the game VOIP as your American accent was brilliant.

[Mike_Nomad]

Thank you for candid observations.... I can only hope TWI adjusts that imbalance.

as for the accent.... I heard yours too and all I could think of was Scottie in Star Trek.

Pleasant memories.

[Major_Day]

Originally Posted by Mike_Nomad

Thank you for candid observations.... I can only hope TWI adjusts that imbalance.

as for the accent.... I heard yours too and all I could think of was Scottie in Star Trek.

Pleasant memories.

That's the reason why i never use voip.........nobody ever understands a bloody word i say

[The Beast (nl)]

Come on, the T34 has still his weak points. I don`t make a movie now.

For me from the beginning the T34 is my favorite tank. That was also
in ROost.

The tanks doesn`t suck, the players do.

There are a couple of good guys who listens and know the tactics and
the weak points.

I haven`t the idea that the panzer now is weaker.

And it still differs if you angle your tank a bit against your enemy.

[r5cya]

Originally Posted by The Beast (nl)

Come on, the T34 has still his weak points. I don`t make a movie now.

For me from the beginning the T34 is my favorite tank. That was also
in ROost.

The tanks doesn`t suck, the players do.

There are a couple of good guys who listens and know the tactics and
the weak points.

I haven`t the idea that the panzer now is weaker.

And it still differs if you angle your tank a bit against your enemy.

either you haven't played tank in the last few days, or you haven't been paying attention. go try a panzer and see if you still feel the same afterwards.

[Mike_Nomad]

Originally Posted by r5cya

either you haven't played tank in the last few days, or you haven't been paying attention. go try a panzer and see if you still feel the same afterwards.

Correct..... most of the regulars on our Servers have been playing RO and DH for YEARS! They do not, in any stretch of the imagination, suck.

The tanks are scrubbed until they're fixed. PZ4=WIMP T34=Hercules.

That just ain't right.

Play tanks...use a PZ4 against the now invincible T34. You'll soon learn a good lesson in what unfair is all about.