Zoom on Light Machine guns [Classic mode]

[Andrew Blake]

Currently there is no zoom on the mg’s, this means you will pixel snipe again at targets 50m away. I personally find this not very appealing. Plus the weird jumping recoil, it’s very different from the mg’s in RO1 would I am guessing they are trying to simulate.

I think we should give back the zoom the mg’s, but not as much as normally. But rather like the SMG’s. So we don’t pixel snipe nor do we become a mobile full auto sniper unit.

[Bashenka]

I'd personally vote to give MGs the same zoom as rifles, because it will make them that much more terrifying to meet on the battlefield (like they should be) !

I'd also like to test out giving equal zoom to everyone, something like 1.5-1.8 zoom and see how that works in the Beta.

[r5cya]

same zoom for all weapons. why should any be different?

[Lord_Lovat]

Same zoom as rifle. The MG is designed to be able to cover large areas and thus great distances. But when you can't see anything far away, it won't be covered, no?

[=GG= Mr Moe]

Machine guns should be very deadly and that should be out to a long range.

(Personally I think all ironsight zoom should be the same)

[Spindle]

We first need realistic recoil....

[Zetsumei]

Same zoom for all weapons but user configurable.

[Nikita]

Same zoom for all weapons... except perhaps pistols.

[Korn-Y]

Originally Posted by Zetsumei

Same zoom for all weapons but user configurable.

+1

Moreover, MGs don't need a better zoom, but a better recoil...

[BBRodriquez]

Why not no zoom in IS for all weapons and additional zoom as much as with the rifle right now with shift?

Thats the way I configed the normal RO2 and it works great.

[Proud_God]

Originally Posted by Zetsumei

Same zoom for all weapons but user configurable.

+1 , + addition of shift zoom if max zoom is set high.

[Verluste]

Originally Posted by =GG= Mr Moe

Machine guns should be very deadly and that should be out to a long range.

(Personally I think all ironsight zoom should be the same)

pretty much this.

You dont want people picking MG class because ''with the zoom you can snipe''. MG class should not work that way. What happened to the RO1 MG-class mentality? Expert knew how to utilise it, without any zoom.

Originally Posted by Zetsumei

Same zoom for all weapons but user configurable.

It should be the same for all users, otherwise it wouldn't be fair.
If you mean everyone gets a little zoom by pressing shift (but not more zoom than the current zoom), I'm ok with that.

[Darrosquall]

no zoom.

[Rak]

You guy realize the reason long range fighting is enjoyable right now is the removal/nerfing of zoom right? Buffing it will make it one step closer to the instagib RO2 gameplay, where everyone has Shift pressed everytime and moving around the battlefield is impossible. It just makes long range shooting a piece of cake and encourages camping over attacking(Fallen Fighters syndrome). Just take a look at this zoom comparison and think about it's effects on gameplay.

Spoiler!

Now, I'm not against a slight standart zoom for all weapons just to mimick focusing in RL(maybe max 1.25 - 1.5x). But making it freely user configurable is just taking it too far.

Please realize this is Classic mode and not RO2 Realism mode.

[=GG= Mr Moe]

Originally Posted by Rak

You guy realize the reason long range fighting is enjoyable right now is the removal/nerfing of zoom right? ...

No, that is a matter of opinion

As someone who plays mostly rifleman, and MG when I can get it, I find it more difficult and less enjoyable at ranges. Now, it is not terrible mind you, but I would prefer to be able to see correctly at a realistic scale.

I don't think the overall issue is to make Classic different than Realism, I think it should be to make it better. That is my opinion.

[Vyllis]

I didn't played MG. But i think all weapon should have the same base zoom.

[Darrosquall]

Originally Posted by Vyllis

I didn't played MG. But i think all weapon should have the same base zoom.

Actually not, for me. It's a feature that other game doesn't have. Mg should do "suppression", with no zoom MG role is more achieved. People should shoot almost random to cover soldiers that goes on.

[marcinz]

Originally Posted by Rak

Now, I'm not against a slight standart zoom for all weapons just to mimick focusing in RL(maybe max 1.25 - 1.5x). But making it freely user configurable is just taking it too far.

Please realize this is Classic mode and not RO2 Realism mode.

Zoom is not focusing! Actually zoomed view (low FOV) is natural one, showing distant objects similar size as they would look in real life.
Try measuring angle between your head and corners of your computer screen (for me it's about 35-40*) -> thats field of view that your screen is capable of displaying without distorting the distance. Of course with FOV40 you have no peripheral vision (imagine wearing horse blinders )

RO2 (like other of FPS games) runs in FOV 70-75 which displayed at computer screen allows you to keep some of your peripheral vision at cost of heavily distorted distance perception (like when looking through wide-angle of fisheye lens)

IS "zoom" (+shift) is your normal vision displayed on computer screen and so-called "normal" view with FOV75 is actually distorted and unzoomed one .

That was just from 'technical' point of view

What i would like to see gameplaywise is ARMA2-like system when you can 'zoom' and 'unzoom' anytime - when aiming with IS, when running etc. It would allow us to choose if we want peripheral vision and no 'zoom' at all (while room clearing) or 'zoomed' view for long range shooting and scanning the battlefield before advancing.

I guess it would not be so hard to implement. Just give us an option to bind zoom to different key than sprint and bring back IS zoom sliders that were in pre-release beta.

[Zetsumei]

Originally Posted by Rak

Now, I'm not against a slight standart zoom for all weapons just to mimick focusing in RL(maybe max 1.25 - 1.5x). But making it freely user configurable is just taking it too far.

There should still be a max allowed zoom. Which ideally for me would be 1.5x or lower. To limit the difference between the zoomed and unzoomed fov's.

But I think that since your eyes do not change that users should be able to set the zoom between 1x and the max say 1.5x for weapons however they prefer. With a seperate button that allows you to get back to the max zoom of say 1.5x.

Even the sliders back in beta still had different max zooms on a per weapon basis.

I would be the last person that would want to allow people to pick the current 2.3x zoom or even worse go up to even higher amounts like 3x zoom or 4x zoom.

Originally Posted by marcinz

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My screen either takes up 75° of my vision (desktop) or 20° of my vision (laptop) so either way the actual zoom is never correct for me.

But don't forget that the most realistic is not necessarily making your computer screen a window to look out of. You don't run around with a window in front of you in real life. You have a near full 180 degree of vision, with very fast eyes that can look everywhere in the scenery in split seconds. Wanting to have a realistic 180 degree fov is just as realistic as wanting to have realistic sizes.

Most games in the past just went on a compromise not giving a full 180 degree vision but only giving you half. Giving you a 90° fov gives you enemies that look twice as small as in real life and half the fov you have in real life. Giving you 45° fov gives you enemies that look approximately the same size as in real life, but at only a quarter of your real life fov (So you cover 16x times less of an area in a single view compared to real life!).

[Barber[FG]]

I do not think the Machine Guns needs zoom at all. I don’t understand why people wish to snipe with them, as that is not the most efficient functional use of a light or heavy machine gun. The most functional uses in the reality of this game fundamentally, are suppression and area denial of the opposing team.

When a player uses the machine gun correctly, he causes his opponents to become suppressed and tied down to cover. Thus, allowing friendly assault troops to move forward and friendly riflemen to pick off anything that the machine gun is suppressing. Believe it or not, when a machine gun has effectively locked the opposing team to a certain area of cover, this is the most opportune time to lay down a mortar strike on the enemy position; while at the same time, moving up in preparation to overrun the position.

More on the machine gun:

The first best use of the machine gun is to use short burst raking . This can be described as a short sweep from left to right or right to left of the machine gun, while at the same time putting out short bursts of controlled fire. Machine gunners typically use this tactic when suppressing a populated enemy position.

The second best use of the machine gun is to use concentrated bursts of fire . This can be described as short bursts of fire at a specific target location over a narrow area. This tactic is typically used in area denial of narrow passageways or high traffic crossways such as street crossings. This tactic is one of my favorite on the Barracks map playing as a German Machine gunner. I once racked up over twenty kills to one death; as the Russians were trying to get into Objective “C”. For some reason they kept running across the same section of street, as it was possiably the fastest route back into the objective.

Anyway, my underlying point is, machine guns are not scoped precision weapons and should not be made to fill that role in a game where rifles, snipers and semi-automatic rifles already do an excellent job at that. We need the machine guns to fill the role they are supposed to fill! Suppression and area denial!