The Post-HoE Sharpshooter: Strategy Meetup

[HawkActual]

Whats up everybody. I've been taking a look at all of the threads actually whining about how the Xbow got nerfed, M14's ROF got slowed, blah blah blah.

But I didn't see anyone making a thread on how to compensate for such (awesome) changes to the Sharpshooter.

So I figured I would start one here for everyone to post up your strategies for 6-man Hell on Earth exclusive tactics for the Sharpshooter.

How do you guys compensate for the necessary rebalancing of the Sharpshooter class?

Here's a vid of what I am practicing:
YouTube - Killing Floor: The Post-HoE Sharpshooter

Let's start a group discussion on how to tackle HoE.

[Darkwave]

Nice shooting.
I miss the reload bonus though...

[xebo]

@HawkActual - I enjoy your posts/videos; think you bring a lot to the forum.
@bswearer - Yeah, and other perks do that job just as well with an xbow, since husks/sirens die to 1 xbow hs regardless of perkage. Sucks right?


Here are SS things:

If your team is in a caravan situation, the SS does not have the firepower to clear a path. No matter the weapon, he only does adequate damage when hitting headshots. This makes him the 2nd worste class to run and gun with (besides demo). Just try to stay alive until FP/scrake show up, tap at the FP with your EBR ( 1 shot / 2 seconds), and stunkill scrakes with your LAR.

You can cut the required distance to take out an FP in half if you use an EBR. It really is as simple as spamming headshots. When he rages he dips his head low, then high. Follow it with your mouse for "Great Success!". You can consistently kill him with 5-7 shells left. LAR is more dangerous because of the ammo limit and increased recoil.

If the scrake's stun animation "Glitches", just hold your xhair over his right shoulder. He'll move his head right into your sights for a quick follow up headshot.

[Deadbolt]

Well, me and a few friends have been trying some hell maps, and are like 3/6 in victories so far. The way we've been doing it was with 2 sharps with xbow, a support, a commando, a medic, and whatever else. Usually the 6th is a beserker covering the back, (map dependent), a demo for crowd control, or another commando. With the FP situation we usually have 3 different turnouts. The most of the time, our sharps are good enough to get 3 headshots off, and then its just quick clean up from the aa12, on the other occasion where we both hit both headshots and hes dead, and the sneak attack where there isnt much time to get headshots, our med purposely targets and meatshields while we all unload on him. The times we from the infamous 2 fps 1 scrake and multiple siren combo.

[Spoony]

Aimbot

[HawkActual]

Originally Posted by Spoony

Aimbot

There is no spoon.

[CA_Hiro]

Originally Posted by xebo

If your team is in a caravan situation, the SS does not have the firepower to clear a path. No matter the weapon, he only does adequate damage when hitting headshots. This makes him the 2nd worste class to run and gun with (besides demo).

Excuse me, but that just requires some awesome aiming and good reflexes with either a 9mm or a HC.

Originally Posted by xebo

Just try to stay alive until FP/scrake show up, tap at the FP with your EBR ( 1 shot / 2 seconds), and stunkill scrakes with your LAR.

You make the xbow sound useless. I find it still useable to the FP even though it has been greatly nerfed. It just demands great aiming + patients and good timing. If the FP is spotted from a great distance, you can just pull the xbow and use the 5-6 shots, you need to take it down. If it's closer or close enough to start the random rage, still try to go for the headshot. It might be weaker, but it still does some major damage.

Oh and I love to rape scrakes with the LAR. It's funny when people can't see how effective the LAR is against a scrake.

[Steeps]

I haven't played much HoE (lately been mostly playing on hard since I'm trying to level up some perks that are at lv 4) but it seems that the LAR/EBR combo is actually somewhat effective. If you have a competent demo and/or decent team that can focus fire fp's they can be easily taken care of. LAR isn't as good as the xbow against scrakes but thanks to the stun with decent aim makes them not much of a threat. Husks are now a bigger threat (though the lar is still effective against them), but in return you get an advantage over pretty much every smaller zed with the m14. I haven't really tried this, but was on a team where someone made this happen effectively.

Also I've been taking 1 handcannon instead of 2 now due to the increase reload time and spamming them not being as effective.

[HawkActual]

Just beat Hospital Horrors HoE with Xbow and Deagle load out.

Battle tested and proven to work against FPs, Scrakes, and random trash.

We ran 2 Xbow SS, 1 M14/LAR SS, 1 Medic, 2 Commandos.

Medic was insane and wedged himself against the FPs aggro path, buying us valuable time to plant our headshots.

Wave 10/10 was absolute hell:
1. Initial 20 seconds, double FP.
- Armor's shredded, everybody's still alive (great job Thufir)

2. Mid-wave, double FP attack again.
- Sirens take out our Commando and other xbow Sharpshooter drops shortly after. (Thufir saves the rest of us who are alive)

3. Close to the end Clean up of a single FP.
- Ammo's scarce, but a spare Xbow bought and left on the helipad keeps me going. Headshotting Husks/Sirens and above for 1 hit wonder play.

4. Everybody switches to Xbow for wave 11/10.
- Party shifts to spawn with the big van.
- I stay by the right-most double vans parked outside and snipe/aggro the Patriarch in a kite path around the van.

5. We Make him drop two of his syringes.

6. We refresh the aggro towards the double vans to keep the kite pattern going. He aggroes the group staying in spawn and insta-kills one with a rocket.

7. We finish him off like we always do with Xbows.

Rocked the !@#$ out of the Patriarch.

[outofrealman]

Originally Posted by CA_Hiro

You make the xbow sound useless. I find it still useable to the FP even though it has been greatly nerfed.

Compare to M14/LAR, yes, xbow is useless (unless you cannot constanly hit the head with M14 like many of the players here). And thanks for the vedio from the op shows us how much range is needed. (may be you should add in M14 dropping pounds to compare?)

Compare to commando and fire bug, of cos xbow is better for pounds:troll:.

[SMIFF]

Originally Posted by outofrealman

Compare to M14/LAR, yes, xbow is useless (unless you cannot constanly hit the head with M14 like many of the players here). And thanks for the vedio from the op shows us how much range is needed. (may be you should add in M14 dropping pounds to compare?)

Compare to commando and fire bug, of cos xbow is better for pounds:troll:.

False, it's viable, a good alternative, it's only Tier 2 remember? If you get your crosshairs on that Husk or Scrake's head, you WILL get the headshot.

Unlike the M14 or LAR, it can penetrate. So a few clots won't completely stop your bullets like they do for LAR/M14. So stop whining about the Crossbow, what, do you want it to be as good as a Tier 3 weapon? Not happening.

Crossbow is fine. I and a lot of other people find it a useful weapon, a good alternative compared to the M14/LAR. If you can't see the benefits it brings, then that's your problem.

Stop complaining about it just because you can't use it properly.

[outofrealman]

Originally Posted by SMIFF

False, it's viable, a good alternative, it's only Tier 2 remember? If you get your crosshairs on that Husk or Scrake's head, you WILL get the headshot.

Unlike the M14 or LAR, it can penetrate. So a few clots won't completely stop your bullets like they do for LAR/M14. So stop whining about the Crossbow, what, do you want it to be as good as a Tier 3 weapon? Not happening.

Crossbow is fine. I and a lot of other people find it a useful weapon, a good alternative compared to the M14/LAR. If you can't see the benefits it brings, then that's your problem.

Stop complaining about it just because you can't use it properly.

If we agree that xbow is T2, and it should only get the power of a T2 weapon, why it cost $800? Why refilling the xbow cost nearly all of your money after buying the armour? Why it is more expensive than a T3 weapon?

T2 weapon should not cost that much.
T3 weapon should not suck that bad.

Again, all you guys can do and will do is unlike posts or think that someone cannot use that weapon well. Dont make it sound like the xbow is the only weapon can penetrate. And we still have other AoE weapons. Even an M32 is cheaper than xbow.

Ak is cheap. And as a commando, most likely you will get both SCAR and ak. Huntting shotgun is really cheap to buy. And give out very good area damage as support. And you can choose to single fire when needed. M79 do decent AoE for trash zeds. And all these weapon is not really effective off-perked.
What about xbow again? Now the main purpose is to kill husks and sirens, but ANYONE with xbow can do it. So, as a sharpshooter, you only use xbow for scrakes to be really effective. Only. Husk and sirens can also be killed easily by a medic using xbow. Pounds? Again you have many better choices.

And why people like to compare M32 with xbow? As a demo you dont really want to pull out your M32 unless you really need to. M79 fire the same nade as the M32. So you get 36+24 shots. With 11 hand nades. Xbow is 36 shots (how much time you can get your arrow back after firing?). If you really need to kill a group of crawlers, you need them in a straight line and you are using your valuable arrow. Unlike M32, you have M79 to spare.

[SMIFF]

Originally Posted by outofrealman

If we agree that xbow is T2, and it should only get the power of a T2 weapon, why it cost $800? Why refilling the xbow cost nearly all of your money after buying the armour? Why it is more expensive than a T3 weapon?

Because it does MASSIVE DAMAGE TO EVERYTHING.
Which I agree is a bit muddled up, but for now, the Crossbow is fine.

[outofrealman]

Originally Posted by SMIFF

Because it does MASSIVE DAMAGE TO EVERYTHING.
Which I agree is a bit muddled up, but for now, the Crossbow is fine.

HA? Why you need that much damage other than scrakes and pounds? A non-perk player with an xbow in hand can kill everything up to sirens and husks in one shot.

Add in the fact that you are a sharpshotoer, you only perform better when facing scrakes. Which can also be killed SAFELY by axe or LAR.

In a team with support, you dont need xbow to penetrate. Hunting shotgun will kill a medium range husk with several clots as meat shield or CLEANING a path lead to an extremely low health husk or siren. When xbow is used, you only stun those gorefasts and clots in front of the target and leave those crawlers in the left and right.

If you really want to use the xbow as a sharpshotoer, you force yourself stuck at a wired position that you cannot help much in clearing trash and pounds. Even if you can place that clean headshot to husks and sirens before the support place that alt-fire, you are only better than that support in that second. And then you dont do much for the team.

In your ideal world that everyone can shoot zeds in the head when a bunch of other zeds is blocking the direct sight, you are impossible to act faster than support as support only need to aim for the body.

Ideal Xbow sharpshooter lose when facing ideal support.
Ideal Xbow sharpshooter lose when facing ideal M14 sharpshooter.

And I believe nothing is better than demo against fleshpounds. (and support and M14 still beat xbow sharpshooter in bringing down fleshpounds)

[Spicy]

I thought the entire point of this thread was to talk about compensating for the Sharpshooter changes. Not being internet retards and arguing about which gun is the best...
:troll:

[SMIFF]

Originally Posted by outofrealman

HA? Why you need that much damage other than scrakes and pounds? A non-perk player with an xbow in hand can kill everything up to sirens and husks in one shot.

Yes, but the SS can do it quicker and a non perked player can't deal with Scrakes and Pounds effectively with it. While an SS can. At most ranges.

Originally Posted by outofrealman

Add in the fact that you are a sharpshotoer, you only perform better when facing scrakes. Which can also be killed SAFELY by axe or LAR.

Safely? That's situational.
SS on the other hand can take them out safely....AT RANGE, quickly, before they even start to become dangerous. Fp's also.

Originally Posted by outofrealman

In a team with support, you dont need xbow to penetrate. Hunting shotgun will kill a medium range husk with several clots as meat shield or CLEANING a path lead to an extremely low health husk or siren. When xbow is used, you only stun those gorefasts and clots in front of the target and leave those crawlers in the left and right.

How about a long range Husk behind a group of Clots?, you know, the one that takes down your health while you can't do anything about it until you get within range.
An SS can take it out instantly, why are you comparing the Xbow to arguably overpowered perks/weapons (Zerk/LAR) anyway?

Originally Posted by outofrealman

If you really want to use the xbow as a sharpshotoer, you force yourself stuck at a wired position that you cannot help much in clearing trash and pounds. Even if you can place that clean headshot to husks and sirens before the support place that alt-fire, you are only better than that support in that second. And then you dont do much for the team.

Taking out threats before they even become actual threats is another benefit to the Crossbow. Add in it's consistent accuracy and ability to recover bolts and you have a very powerful weapon, it humiliates HS at long range and can still be somewhat useful at close range, due to bolt recovery, massive damage and penetration.

Originally Posted by outofrealman

In your ideal world that everyone can shoot zeds in the head when a bunch of other zeds is blocking the direct sight, you are impossible to act faster than support as support only need to aim for the body.

Maybe at closer range, in most cases I agree, how about long range?
It simply outperforms Support at long range in every single way.

Originally Posted by outofrealman

Ideal Xbow sharpshooter lose when facing ideal support.
Ideal Xbow sharpshooter lose when facing ideal M14 sharpshooter.

False. Funny how you factor in a players accuracy when it comes to Xbow, but not the M14. You seem to think that everyone gets consistent headshots with the M14. They don't.

Originally Posted by outofrealman

And I believe nothing is better than demo against fleshpounds. (and support and M14 still beat xbow sharpshooter in bringing down fleshpounds)

Maybe Demo is better against FP's, but he's TERRIBLE at close quarter combat. Unlike the SS.

Crossbow is better at instantly taking out long range threats over support and M14. And does A LOT more damage in 1 shot, which could be the difference between life and death.

[outofrealman]

Originally Posted by SMIFF

Yes, but the SS can do it quicker and a non perked player can't deal with Scrakes and Pounds effectively with it. While an SS can. At most ranges.

With xbow, NO. Sorry. Even on farm pound dont spawn that far away. In any other map, you just dont have enough space for 4 shots. If you consider another sharpshooter to help, each of them only need 5 head shots with M14.

Originally Posted by SMIFF

Safely? That's situational.
SS on the other hand can take them out safely....AT RANGE, quickly, before they even start to become dangerous. Fp's also.

It's your teamate's fail if they make you run into one pound/scrake with a bunch of trash. If they do their job well, and you dont suck using M14, it is no way you cannot kill them in 1v1 suitiation. (and it should be 1v1 if your team dont sucks)

Originally Posted by SMIFF

How about a long range Husk behind a group of Clots?, you know, the one that takes down your health while you can't do anything about it until you get within range.
An SS can take it out instantly, why are you comparing the Xbow to arguably overpowered perks/weapons (Zerk/LAR) anyway?

Farm again? Or else I cant see any other map that husks and sirens shows and support cannot kill them fast enough. (unless your team choose a bad spot...?) If that husk is really that far away, his fireball can be dodge. And sirens cant do damage untill they get close enough to supports who supposed to be in front of the team.

Originally Posted by SMIFF

Taking out threats before they even become actual threats is another benefit to the Crossbow. Add in it's consistent accuracy and ability to recover bolts and you have a very powerful weapon, it humiliates HS at long range and can still be somewhat useful at close range, due to bolt recovery, massive damage and penetration.

I forget... how many clots can you kill with one blot if you line them up? 3? or 4? And if you want your bolt back, you need to aim really low or you will run into a bunch of clots and crawlers when you try to get it back. If you want penetration, you cannot get your bolt back. (oh, if you have god-like skill to line up 5+ clot's head, I will agree with you)

Originally Posted by SMIFF

Maybe at closer range, in most cases I agree, how about long range?
It simply outperforms Support at long range in every single way.

May be I haven't run into a team that god enough to hold somewhere wide open enough making support cannot perform well. Even at spawn point of biolab support can kill up to gorefasts near the other side of the hallway, on HoE of cos.

Originally Posted by SMIFF

False. Funny how you factor in a players accuracy when it comes to Xbow, but not the M14. You seem to think that everyone gets consistent headshots with the M14. They don't.

You factor most players can get 4 head shot to kill pounds(you consider that easy and effective) and yet you think people cannot hit his big head 10 times with laser sight??????? Seriously?

You claim that I am complaining because I cannot use xbow well. But end up YOU cannot use M14 well...

Originally Posted by SMIFF

Maybe Demo is better against FP's, but he's TERRIBLE at close quarter combat. Unlike the SS.

Help your demo by standing in front of him but not blocking his line of fire. Demo SHOULD stay at the back. If you force the demo to get too close to the zeds, you are not helping.

Originally Posted by SMIFF

Crossbow is better at instantly taking out long range threats over support and M14. And does A LOT more damage in 1 shot, which could be the difference between life and death.

WHYYYY I need a weapon with that much damage, again? Non-perk xbow user kill things in one shot up to husks. And you ONLY take away 1/6 health from a 6-man HoE pound. (I suggest you test how much health you can take using M32 and hunting shotgun) And like you keep saying, now the xbow is ONLY good against scrakes, husks and sirens. For husks and sirens you dont even need to be sharpshooter:troll:. Then we leave the xbow sharpshooter only shines when facing scrakes only. *sigh*

And I really dont think you can drop fp with xbow fast enough. Hell... you cannot even miss once when using xbow. Compare with other pound killers: M32 M14 AA12, etc, all of them allow some space for mistake. And even if you miss some shots, you seriously hurt the pound. Let me remind one thing: after 3 shots of xbow the fleshpound in 6-men HoE still have ~50% health. Unlike 10-20% health after spamming M32 or AA12. M14 still leave the pound with ~50% health after 9 shots, but you have 20 shots in one clip.

[Verashiden]

First post .

For an SS, what do people think about Crossbow/Scar (assuming you can get a Commando to buy it for you)? I've been trying it recently and it feels like a good combination to take out the bigger zeds while being able to deal with the smaller stuff in between.

[ph30nix]

Originally Posted by Verashiden

First post .

For an SS, what do people think about Crossbow/Scar (assuming you can get a Commando to buy it for you)? I've been trying it recently and it feels like a good combination to take out the bigger zeds while being able to deal with the smaller stuff in between.

I didn't think you. Could hold both?

[SuperMultiKiller]

The bow isn't as good as m14 but it's fun to use now since it's not one shot kill anymore. Also you don't have room for lar either so the game is challenging enough.

I use xbow, handcannon, machete and maybe pipes if i have the money.
Xbow is good for all the big enemies and handcannon+9mm are good against small ones. Machete is good for saving money, it can kill all small enemies easily if you aren't overwhelmed. Even crawlers die to one hit with alt fire.