Seriously.... pple are whining about 1 shot HS kills?!?!?!?

[Bandit451]

Joecheeze, I do not think you understand the argument here. I, and many others believe that the crossbow is overpowered in the hands of a non-Sharpshooter, and rediculously overpowered in the hands of a Sharpshooter.
You do not need to "do the math" to find out if a Fleshpound dies when you shoot it in the head. Go to any hard mode game, pick up a crossbow, and shoot one. No matter which class you pick, it will die in one headshot. This is silly. For a gun that costs $400, no matter what perk you are, to one hit kill anything in the game is silly, and feels very un-fun. If I wanted an easy game, I would put it on beginner, not on hard/suicidal.
And this is without the Sharpshooter Perk, with it, the crossbow is stupidly overpowered. Watch this video, it is of a level 6 Sharpshooter on Doom2final, Suicidal, Poundamonium mutator.

YouTube - KillingFloor Sharpshooter Doom2

Notice how he completely kills everything without getting damadged once? Do you think ANY OTHER CLASS can do that?
It is silly to think that this is fair or balanced in any way, and it is incredibly not fun for me to have one class/gun combo that is significantly better than the rest, so much so that it makes many of them obsolete.

Originally Posted by Nanostrike

It's a weapon that Scrakes are weak against that takes up, quite literally, 2/3 of your space, reloads slow, is inaccurate without a scope, and has low ammo. It's fair enough with those limitations.

And Nanostrike, It has no limitations. Flamethrower, Hunting Shotgun, AA-12, LAW, all take up 10 or more blocks. Yet they are not as powerful as the Crossbow. Reload is negligible at range. It is extremely accurate without a Scope, seriously, scope in and use a marker(erasable) to put a dot right in the center of your screen. The bolt will fly through this dot, 100% of the time, everytime, running or not, the gun's bobbing does nothing. Ammo is no problem, every ammo box gives you 8 bolts, and you can pick up bolts you have fired. Somehow killing a Fleshpound and getting all your ammo back feels overpowered. And it's only $400! You can buy 3 and keep a stockpile for yourself, at the same cost as a level 6 Support Specialist pays for an AA-12!

[anthracy]

Originally Posted by Bandit451

Joecheeze, I do not think you understand the argument here. I, and many others believe that the crossbow is overpowered in the hands of a non-Sharpshooter, and rediculously overpowered in the hands of a Sharpshooter.
You do not need to "do the math" to find out if a Fleshpound dies when you shoot it in the head. Go to any hard mode game, pick up a crossbow, and shoot one. No matter which class you pick, it will die in one headshot. This is silly. For a gun that costs $400, no matter what perk you are, to one hit kill anything in the game is silly, and feels very un-fun. If I wanted an easy game, I would put it on beginner, not on hard/suicidal.
And this is without the Sharpshooter Perk, with it, the crossbow is stupidly overpowered. Watch this video, it is of a level 6 Sharpshooter on Doom2final, Suicidal, Poundamonium mutator.

By the way, you'll notice that one xbow bolt on solo can take out TWO fleshpounds(suicidal)

On 6 man suicidal, one xbow bolt can take down one flesh easily.

[Uk1t4k3]

Originally Posted by Zerethon

I'm going to be blunt here

You Are Dumb.

The ONLY perk that should be capable of wiping the floor with heavy specimens by headshotting them is the sharpshooter, sharpshooters are THERE for THAT PURPOSE

A Medic/Firebug/Demo/Etc. without the +headshot bonus should NOT be capable of a 1-hit KO on heavies with the Xbow, thats the point being argued here

Crossbow needs a serious tweak so it's not the i-win weapon for EVERY class

Hell yea make xbow bonus dmg only available to sharpshooter so that nobody can complain about any class can one hit FP or scrake.

[eamonn]

I'm not too sure about the crossbow and FP headshots (I hardly ever play SS, especially since it's so popular) but I think the M14 is a bit of a problem. It gives sharpshooters a disgusting rate of fire.

[BenJ0^uk]

FP 1 shot HS on Suicidal with SS regardless of Perk.....it's the Perk of the Perk I guess!

[xyrz]

Originally Posted by BenJ0^uk

FP 1 shot HS on Suicidal with SS regardless of Perk.....it's the Perk of the Perk I guess!

WTF?! FP 1 shot headshot on suicidal with sharpshooter regardless of perk?

Does not compute.

[driftwood]

Since the patch, I end up playing mostly lv6 SS (coz I can't resist spawning with xbow and buying cheap handcannons for me and team).

I Think I have enough experience to bring something new to the table that I think is being overlooked in this thread:

-The XBow seems to insta-decap scrakes and FPs, but its base damage does not seem overpowered. That is, against all other enemies, it seems fine to me. From my experience on Hard servers:
-Bloats can survive up to 3 Xbow shots to the chest, and a HS doesn't seem to reliably kill them. The ridiculous thing is a single shot from a lv6 SS's 9mm will insta-gib a bloat, sometimes even if the head is missed. 9mm HS always kills bloat, but not reliably with Xbow!
-Husks and Sirens I think are spot on. One good headshot will take them out, otherwise you need 2 bolts for Siren, usually 2 but sometimes 3 for Husk.

So it seems to me that there is code to specifically make the XBow anti-scrake/fp. I can appreciate the intention - perhaps trying to make the weapon scale better as a (stupidly cheap) alternative to EBR. But it is currently completely broken, as that hilarious utube video posted by Bandit illustrates perfectly.

[nath2009uk]

Lol.
This threads like Facepunch on a Friday night.

Does it take 3 pages to realise:

Xbow is OP and can headshot pretty much anything in one shot, including FPs and Scrakes.

It needs to be fixed.

[driftwood]

Originally Posted by nath2009uk

Lol.
This threads like Facepunch on a Friday night.

Does it take 3 pages to realise:

Xbow is OP and can headshot pretty much anything in one shot, including FPs and Scrakes.

It needs to be fixed.

The nature of forums is that there's pretty much never a consensus and the ensuing arguments can go on for many pages. People spend a lot of time here because they enjoy discussing the game and speaking their mind as free people.

[kingkong]

Originally Posted by Bandit451

It has no limitations. Flamethrower, Hunting Shotgun, AA-12, LAW, all take up 10 or more blocks. Yet they are not as powerful as the Crossbow. Reload is negligible at range. It is extremely accurate without a Scope, seriously, scope in and use a marker(erasable) to put a dot right in the center of your screen. The bolt will fly through this dot, 100% of the time, everytime, running or not, the gun's bobbing does nothing. Ammo is no problem, every ammo box gives you 8 bolts, and you can pick up bolts you have fired. Somehow killing a Fleshpound and getting all your ammo back feels overpowered. And it's only $400! You can buy 3 and keep a stockpile for yourself, at the same cost as a level 6 Support Specialist pays for an AA-12!

Originally Posted by driftwood

So it seems to me that there is code to specifically make the XBow anti-scrake/fp. I can appreciate the intention - perhaps trying to make the weapon scale better as a (stupidly cheap) alternative to EBR. But it is currently completely broken, as that hilarious utube video posted by Bandit illustrates perfectly.

I don't see your point. what is a small wave of fleshpounds coming through the same door one at a time on a bad map supposed to prove? how many shots should it take to bring them down? 2? 3? why don't you tell us exactly what you would do to fix it.

[Bandit451]

Exactly that, make it take 2 or 3 shots to kill a Flespound.
The video is self explanatory, your post even explains it:

Originally Posted by kingkong

...wave of fleshpounds...

No class should be able to do that! The diffculty was on suicidal in that video!
Lower the damage and increase the price, its not that hard.

[Meismenotyou]

A sharpshooter with a crossbow can kill everything in one shot. The only exception is the patriarch (When not playing solo). If it takes you more then one bolt to kill your target, then you are simply not hitting the head hit box correctly.

[ANTHEM]

Originally Posted by akstylish

Even if we assume the headshot bonus is 8x as some people say:

Flesh Pound health on 6 man suicidal: (1500 base+375*5 players)*1.75=5906.25

Scrake health on 6 man suicidal: (1000 base+500*5 players)*1.75 suicidal=6125

lvl 6 ss xbow headshot damage: 300 base*8 headshot bonus*1.6 ss damage bonus*1.5 ss headshot bonus=5760

I must've done something wrong but can't find it.

that's quite wrong.

A fleshpound wouldn't have more health than the patriarch.

[Zerethon]

Originally Posted by ANTHEM

that's quite wrong.

A fleshpound wouldn't have more health than the patriarch.

Beginner patriarch with ~3 people = 9500+

[joecheeze]

in the video you notice that it is just a single person correct? The hit boxes for the HS are now fixed, this I am certain that you are aware of. Not to mention it is the doom map. I agree that the xbow needs some attention in the area of infinite penetration. however, given the circumstances of the video, many can forget that other instances would not prove as simple (i.e. the stock map list).

[Zerethon]

Originally Posted by joecheeze

in the video you notice that it is just a single person correct? The hit boxes for the HS are now fixed, this I am certain that you are aware of. Not to mention it is the doom map. I agree that the xbow needs some attention in the area of infinite penetration. however, given the circumstances of the video, many can forget that other instances would not prove as simple (i.e. the stock map list).

Any halfway good player can trail mobs around on any official map with utter ease, i do it as a demo all the time

i fail to see a point here

[Xer0]

Well a simple fix for this xbow overpowered thing is , make it so only lvl 5-6 SS can decap Scrakes and FPs easily (or just only SS). Any other class holding the xbow can still do a good amount of damage but can't decap unless they are "lucky". That way there is a balance. I'm sure that is what was intended from the beginning but something got messed up in an update.

[brick_top1982]

Before any class can do this with either a knife or a 9mm. I'm glad that it has reduced to only one class.

[outofrealman]

It is really fine for a "sniper perk" using a "sniper" to head shot killing anything IMO. If a sniper can't kill a specimen with a head shot, what's the point of playing the sniper?

Of coz, other perks can also one shot killing fleshpound is ridiculous, but why the sharpshooter can one shot killing a specimen makes such a big problem? If a sharpshooter needs to put 4-5 blots to the head before you can take down a fleshpound even you are 6lv, what's the point of playing the sharpshooter? Support, commando and demo all can take down flesh pounds, but they dont really need to aim for the head, the just keep firing.

Also, talk about the vedio of doom... well, the map is made for you to do this, NONE of the official maps you can "line up" specimens that easily. YES, you can kill 2 fleshpounds with one blot even on suicidal, BUT HOW can you line up 2 fleshpounds in any "normal" map?


edit: Oh, I forgot to mention, one snigle pipe bomb can take out a GROUP of fleshpounds on solo hard game even you are not using the demo class, if close enough, one pipe bomb can also kill Scrakes in suicidal. Which one you think is more "overpowered"? It is ridiculous to kill those "big guys" with one hit if you are not the expert (5lv+) of that class, but if you are a 6lv of a class and using those weapons of that class, you should be strong enough to take down big specimens much more easier. Also, if you can beat every game in suicidal and want some "challange", try to play first 6 waves with melee weapons ONLY.

[Deafmute]

Originally Posted by outofrealman

IOh, I forgot to mention, one snigle pipe bomb can take out a GROUP of fleshpounds on solo hard game even you are not using the demo class

Yeah, but who really plays solo? On 6 man hard one pipe bomb certainly won't take out a group of Fleshpounds.