AP & HE rounds

[short-fuse]

Ok... try this on for size..


http://uk.youtube.chttp://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=QJ6gjUAMpaAom/watch?v=QJ6gjUAMpaA


Case in point... the entry shells of the 8.8cm in the side of the turret. Now why can't I get a shot like that in this "so called" sim?

And the Panzer commanders are NOT angling their tanks, are they. Most, if not all, are facing the enemy and not at a angle. Hell, there is proof that one tiger is firing a broadside and he isn't worried about the russian tanks. Plus, there is mention of the 8.8cm piercing beyond 1000m, its more like 3000m. Now why can't they correct this in the game? Is that too much to ask for?

[Solo4114]

Because this isn't a sim. Yes, I know the box described "sim-level tank combat", but the box was very poorly worded. It's not a sim. It was never intended to be a sim. On the other hand, it's as close to a sim as we've seen in typical FPS gaming, so take it for what it's worth.

The issue with angling has been discussed to death. Everyone knows angling is overused, largely due to two factors: (1) it's made far more effective in-game than it was in real life, and (2) immobilizing shots are one in a million. In real life, if you angled too far, sure the shot MIGHT bounce off you (or not), but you'd also be exposing your tracks and begging to be turned into a piss-poor pillbox.


If you want more realistic tank combat, look for a server running AB. It ain't perfect, but it's some better than stock RO.


Now, my question still stands: does APCR lose penetrating power IN-GAME over range, or does it remain constant? Again, this is IN-GAME only. I don't need an historical treatise on how APCR lost power over range and was better for close-range shooting. I'm asking how the GAME models it.

[TT33]

Originally Posted by Solo4114

Does APCR lose penetrating power IN-GAME over range, or does it remain constant?

It probably remains nearly constant judging from current tank cannons in game. For example the T34/76 can penetrate the side of the Tiger (80 mm) in game at very long ranges when it should not be effective at more than 150 m. The T34/85 can penetrate the Tiger frontally from any range when it should not be effective at about 500 meters and greater depending upon what you hit in the front of the Tiger. The T-60's gun appears not to lose any power in the game sometimes only a couple of shots at long range. For example on Orel day 1 a T-60 shot and killed a Panzer III L from behind the Westfield house back on the hill overlooking it and the Panzer III L was in between the ruins and the westfield house moving towards westfield.

HE rounds are good for weakening a tanks armor

Realistically it would take alot of repeated hits with a team of HE shooting weapons to damage or cause armor sprawling when the caliber is small. For example there are alot of accounts of the Tiger I taking repeated HE rounds from the Su-122 although the Tiger was heavily damaged it was not destroyed but again thats expected since the caliber is a very large explosive caliber. A few 76mm or 75mm HE rounds are not effective against tanks especially heavy tanks like the Tiger I or the IS-2.

[short-fuse]

[quote=Solo4114;360526]Because this isn't a sim. Yes, I know the box described "sim-level tank combat", but the box was very poorly worded. It's not a sim. It was never intended to be a sim. On the other hand, it's as close to a sim as we've seen in typical FPS gaming, so take it for what it's worth.

The issue with angling has been discussed to death. Everyone knows angling is overused, largely due to two factors: (1) it's made far more effective in-game than it was in real life, and (2) immobilizing shots are one in a million. In real life, if you angled too far, sure the shot MIGHT bounce off you (or not), but you'd also be exposing your tracks and begging to be turned into a piss-poor pillbox.

If has been discussed to death, then why doesn't someone from the design team do something about it? Or are they just sitting back getting fat and lazy?


If you want more realistic tank combat, look for a server running AB. It ain't perfect, but it's some better than stock RO.

Yeah, I know about the AB and its wizzardry but, not all the servers are running it. Someone took the time and corrected the design teams F up, it should have been an "instant" downloadable update for all servers and players.

As for tank sims, this mediocre FPS will suffice until T vs T.

[Hunt3r.j2]

I'm wondering, how DO you switch from AP to APCR/HE?

[Solo4114]

Originally Posted by short-fuse

If has been discussed to death, then why doesn't someone from the design team do something about it? Or are they just sitting back getting fat and lazy?

Two things.

1.) My advice here is to mind the attitude. I can understand the frustration with the system, but calling the devs names isn't gonna accomplish much more than get you ignored or worse.

2.) Short version on why nothing's been done: Because it'd take way more than (a) the engine is capable of handling, and (b) the dev team has by way of resources. Most stock RO tank maps are close range affairs, so pretty much we have "hammers vs. eggshells" in a lot of cases. Long range maps only recently became possible with the engine. Also, to REALLY do realsitic tank combat you'd need a lot of stuff, including but not limited to: armor spalling code, far more "critical hit" locations (IE: tank wheels, vision blocks, gun elevators, turret ring traverse mechanisms, etc.), and a ton of new maps to actually allow for real tanking tactics.

Yeah, I know about the AB and its wizzardry but, not all the servers are running it. Someone took the time and corrected the design teams F up, it should have been an "instant" downloadable update for all servers and players.

Yep. That's because it's a mutator and because it can only go so far so a lot of people say "Eh, why bother?" As for why a mutator wasn't "officially" adopted, wel, there's various theories, but two easily accepted ones are: (1) if it was that popular everyone would've downloaded it anyway, and (2) nobody wanted to address the legal BS involved in incorporating mutators into official releases, to the extent there was any. Others may point out some...disagreements between the dev team and the creator of the mutator who also was a bit impolitic in getting his point across.

As for tank sims, this mediocre FPS will suffice until T vs T.

Groovy. Problem solved, then.

[Elysium]

I can't see how hard it is to make the 88mm cannon realistic. Almost has the same power as the T-34/85 cannon in the game but in real life they were one-shot-kill cannons.

[Solo4114]

Because so many OTHER things are wrong with the tanking system that merely "fixing" the 88mm wouldn't help anything, or at least wouldn't go anywhere near far enough.

It's only because of the perception that the Tiger was teh ubar tankz and could kill anything by sneezing at it that people tend to focus on the flaws with the Tiger.

There's plenty of things wrong with ALL of the tanks due to this or that not being modeled. The Tiger's main gun being weaker than it should be is just one of them. I hear it's fixed in AB, though.