INF style projectile penetration mutator available!

[Ron]

The only level i noticed any fps drop was on odessa on the debuke server for some reason? allthough this has been mentioned.

[Arete]

Road_to_hill also got some performance problems with the mutator on DBDUK. Had a round on Lazur before that one yesterday, and by gods you can kill with the MG now :-D
Just being able to clear a doorway by firing of a a mag through the walls.... *drooools*

[Phoenix-D]

Sorry Beppo, I'm used to head in the cloud devs.

("It doesn't work that way."
"Really? Here's a video showing it does."
"IT DOESN'T DO THAT.")

[Beppo]

As said, maybe it is the non existing 'zero space'. If you fire at the ground and/or terrain a projectile is now able to penetrate, it then shows up in empty space that is not 'zero space'. Means a projectile is able to exist within this empty space below the actual terrain. So, with the empty space being pretty huge actually, the projectiles will most likely exist for a much longer time period than without the penetration.

I guess one way of 'fixing' this a bit would be to actually edit the RO maps and place some blocking volumes below the maps playing areas so that projectiles that were able to penetrate the "ground" - be it terrain, BSP or a Static mesh - will not have a long flight anymore till they actually reach the giant box surrounding the whole map - which is something pretty weird in itself actually, the giant box it is.

[Jaesperson]

are the bullet physics affected in anyway when they hit a wall?
does the angle of impact have any significance?

[zeep]

Originally Posted by Jaesperson

are the bullet physics affected in anyway when they hit a wall?
does the angle of impact have any significance?

Yes they are affected, no there is no ricochet code implemented (not yet anyway).

[Moz]

why don't you kill projectiles that have penetrated after a set amount of time.

once a projectile has move through something after a couple of miliseconds it destroys itself. So if it goes though terrain it won't fly so long

[Murphy]

Can´t you code that it can´t penetrate terrains at all? I mean, there´s no occasion where that might be of use, right?

[Jaesperson]

this would mean that a thin piece of a hilltop would give you cover from MG fire

[Beppo]

Destroying a projectile after it had penetrated something is actually against the whole purpose of this mutator. If a projectile would be able to ie. hit a wall, fly down a whole corridor to then hit a window again and to then kill the guy standing behind it - call it a good aimed sniper shot fe. - then this wouldn't be possible anymore. Same for two thin wooden doors or a wooden fence of some sort.
The whole purpose of this mutator actually is to penetrate more or less realistically so that you cannot hide behind every little wall or whatever you use for cover that wouldn't stop a projectile in real life too.
So, destroying it after a specific amount of time is no option. In addition the standard lifetime of a projectile in RO is 5 seconds max by default.

And as Jaesperson already said, terrain has to stay penetrateable for numerous reasons.

[radix]

How about to increase the step for SetLocation from 16uu to 32uu. It should reduce somehow the CPU load (less steps). The avatars hit cilinders are anyway bigger (i think) than 32uu and the chance to get a "miss" hit is very small. (SelLocation at 63uu from the wall)

If it is working good I would parametrized the steps (16, 32, 64) tht the mut can be run also on the weaker servers.

Another ideea (i don't know if it is implemented or if it is good) is to kill the bullet after n (2 - 10) not penetrated steps. If the bullet could not penetrate in 10 steps (16 * 10 = 160uu ~3m(?) it should be killed).

Just some toughts. I would really like to see the penetration sys working perfectlly .

[Murphy]

Originally Posted by Jaesperson

this would mean that a thin piece of a hilltop would give you cover from MG fire

As the terrain is mostly flat the occasions where a bullet should penetrate it are rather rare anyway, aren´t they?
There are no terrain spikes to hide behind. Well, there are hilltops but most hills are flat enough so that you are behind quite some dirt of you want to take cover behind them so I guess its ok if the bullet is stopped there.

I´m sure most of use are willing to accept a tradeoff if it helps the servers.

[Hyperion2010]

Lying behind a small hillock right now just means you get shot in the rump instead of sprayed in the face with dirt and possibly hit in the arm/head area

[Beppo]

@radix ... each projectile has a maximum distance it is able to penetrate thru ie. a wall. So the SetLocation stuff stops after 1 to 4 steps normally.

@Murphy ... try out Stalingrad. The snowy terrain lets you fire thru the snow caps now too. And if someone prone crawls backward from a 'hill top' you will still be able to hit him for a second or two by shooting at the top terrain 'incline'.
In addition you can setup one terrain per zone within UED. This way you can ie. use terrain on different heights, as 'decos' on flat rooftops too and a lot more. So terrain could cover spots your projectiles should be able to penetrate.

Well, without ballistics and a possible multi-penetration of several walls in a row you would be able to make a quick check if something is actually behind the wall in a reasonable distance by using a trace check and if nothing is there you could simply say that the projectile wouldn't matter anymore. But who knows if a split second later a player would step into the flight path and how much the ballistics will change the flight path too to let the projectile actually hit something after penetrating. So, without actually knowing that the projectile is within a map area that noone can ever reach you have no clue about it being deleteable without any consequences.
If the maps would have proper zoning, blocking volumes or stuff alike, then we wouldn't need to think about this at all. The blocking volumes or whatever would be used, would be easy to check via script normally.

[zeep]

No dev response yet? Well i'm hoping there will be one once the map and vehicles are released. I really want this mutator out there, adding to our game. As it is now. it seems there are no servers running this anymore, which is a damn shame.

Dev's, please copy/paste that info necessary for Beppo/Geo their way.

[KrazyKraut]

Yeah I can't beleive this, there's enough servers pout there to at least have one or two running this mutator 24/7 EVEN IF it is buggy atm. I haven't played it only a single time.

[Velcro Warrior]

Why not just decompile Ostfront, and implement the code? I know of at least one person who's done so (at least in the mod version) to experiment with a anti-cheat mutator, and for other purposes.

[Phoenix-D]

Originally Posted by Velcro Warrior

Why not just decompile Ostfront, and implement the code? I know of at least one person who's done so (at least in the mod version) to experiment with a anti-cheat mutator, and for other purposes.

VAC. You could test it out, but you'd have to run a non-VAC server at the very least; I'm not sure how Steam handles different versions of games floating around, either. It might force you to re-download or re-patch.

[Velcro Warrior]

Originally Posted by Phoenix-D

VAC. You could test it out, but you'd have to run a non-VAC server at the very least; I'm not sure how Steam handles different versions of games floating around, either. It might force you to re-download or re-patch.

Well I meant to at least experiment and "properly" implement the code...

[popbob]

Originally Posted by Velcro Warrior

Why not just decompile Ostfront, and implement the code? I know of at least one person who's done so (at least in the mod version) to experiment with a anti-cheat mutator, and for other purposes.

Which is illegal...

Anyway, this is a great mut, and I just played on the 5SS server, I was actually able to nail people under shards of debris now.