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Ok treading on a sensitive issue here... The Medic & The Zerker.

So much text... Which is why I didn't read it, but would like to (politely) ask...

Was it agreed upon that Speed was the issue with Medic/Beserker? When I melee stuff, I can run forward, hit it, dash back to avoid the ones behind it and be unscaved. Yet, any other class without the speed bonus, I quickly get overrun...
Heck, with the Medic/Beserker speed bonus, Gorefasts can't even catch me... And sometimes Patriarch. (My Medic is level 5, too - So not the cap speed)

Medic and Beserker should be faster but I don't think fast enough to avoid Gorefasts... Well, maybe Beserker.


On HoE you never able to out run gorefasts. But if you are lucky enough, they will stop to attack, but this is nothing about speed. Just by chance.
 
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That which you refer to as "blanking", would that fit its definition?

This is false.
For some reason, this is also one pillar your whole argumentation stands on.
Do you see the problem here yet?

Citation needed.
Where does a dev actually state the reason for the speed nerf?
If you're just making assumptions.

Now let me repeat that I do in fact (to a degree) agree with those changes but for different reasons.
1) The FP axing is more of an exploit than a "tactic".
2) There was no actual need for the zerker speed buff as well as the medic speed nerf.

So after all of that, these are the lines you pick out?

So every actual point I made was not worth a mention? and yet
- my not understanding your earlier posts
- a point that is true and yet somehow is false at the same time
- a comment that lacked a dev actually saying "This is why we are nerfing this"
- my motivation for posting, despite the result
were more important that the things that actually refer to the gameplay? This is what I mean by blanking, you've picked all the irrelevant parts and used them to undermine my entire post.


So alright I'll bite.

Spoiler!


So no, I don't see the problem, because you haven't backed up anything that you have said. If you have in earlier posts, would a quote have been too much to ask for?

And seriously if your not challenging the changes I have suggested, why bother picking apart my posts in the first place? Thats why there has been so much confusion, because your challenging things that have no purpose being challenged other than starting a debate over nothing. Honestly its not that far removed from trolling.

@ outofrealman

Spoiler!

So cheers for actually addressing the issue itself dude, I'm no all knowing god, but I definately feel these changes would only enhance the Killing Floor experience for everyone. Including Berserkers, cause lets face it, winning by exploiting just isn't cool. :rolleyes:
 
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Why?
Spoiler!
 
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Remember if you are working with your team in theory as a Berserker you shouldn't need to deal with Husks, Sirens and crawlers, because someone should be taking them out for you. That was all that video was for.

It was merely the statement "Clearly he hasn't played Berserker" that got up my nostrils, so I too will apologise for possibly overreacting



You will need to CONSTANLY deal with them... because you are standing in the front line... xbow sharpshooters supposed to using 9mm or handcannons, they spot husks or sirens as soon as they spot you. You they attack before the sharpshooter can switch weapon (or support switch from aa12 to hunting shotgun), open the scope, and fire. And this is what happens in my beta play (which most players are good).


The Berserker was always a high skilled class, the problem is by making him more accessible to lower skilled players, it has effectively made pro Berserkers virtually unstoppable, good berserkers very unlikely to get killed, even when alone and mediocre Berserkers able to get away with alot of very sloppy play (i.e. running around in cirles for 20 minutes killing 1 clot every 30 seconds.). The fact he can usually get away with making such mistakes, makes him a the prefferred choice for noobish players, thereby ruining the game experience for everyone else playing HoE.

Even if these changes are only made to HoE, I'd be fine with that, because lets face it, you shouldn't be playing HoE if your only course of action is to kite everything.


Not in HoE dude, 150 specimens as any other perk is pretty much a death sentence, and isn't that what HoE is for? If your teamwork isn't up to it, then your going to lose. Its technically possible sure, but it requires so much luck with the spawns as well as the skill to beat it, its untrue. This simply isn't the case with the Zerker.

Berserkers use his speed to deal with 100+ zeds, supports an sharpshooter use their damage out put to gun their way trough. Good berserkers can win, and good sharpshooters or support can do the same. May be a little bit more difficult. In fact, blinding by husks can already kill you with full health as berserker.


He can, but he is meant to be a hard hitter, he isn't very good against the likes of crawlers and stalkers because they are fast and hard to headshot. Plus he is slow, so its a case of Kill them before they reach you, or die. This is what makes the Sharpshooter balanced

It is funny that when talk about commando or something like that, stalkers and crawelrs is VERY EASY to head shot. When talk about sharpshooters, suddenly they become hard to head shot.


I agree its only small, but it at least keeps specimens in the realm of being able to keep up. As I say the medic gets slowed down by pretty much everything, because its unlikely he will actually kill a specimen, only decap them (so he gets body blocked) or he can get grabbed by clots, or simply just surrounded by stalkers, crawlers and gorefasts.The Berserker doesn't have this issue, since he rarely even gets slowed down. And on the rare occasion he does get surrounded, he can get out again. SImply with his higher speed, he is TOO good at running. Once again he doesn't really get stopped by sloppy play.

Even you make them only have 20% speed bonus, they will still be TOO GOOD at running... just like using ANY perks on hard, its easy to kite, cos you out run everything. And if you dont even give them speed bonus, it sucks reall bad when played properly (stick with the team).


All other classes have to deal with the FP rage, if the Berserker does it right, he doesn't, and thats what is where he has a advantage over everyone else.


Sharpshooters with M14 or demo with M32 dont. Medic also...

Do we really should pay that much attention to rambo or solo play? This game shouldnt be played like that.... you nerf the kiting ability will also affect team play. Solo can be beated by any perk, and again... NOTHING IN THIS WORLD stops rambos. Balance team play is enough already.

He does still have a good chance, as long as the Fleshpounds have already been spawned and dealth with. Plus remember the FP is weaker against grenades, which have been buffed, so the Zerker isn't defenceless against the FP, but it is osmehting that makes him crap his pants... which is a good thing :)

Clutching it should be something where the team is egging you on to do it because it is hard to do, not something where people see a zerker left and go "Jesus christ here we go again."


Berserker only have 5 nades... and even clots is fast enough to walk far enough to make the "even buffed" granade next to useless. So, you need one to force a fleshpound to change direction, and at least one more to do real damage, and this will rage him without doing any serious damage. As a berserker, axe him or even exchange hits is better...



True, but as we've stated the Berserker is actively encouraged to rambo, because if he knows what he is doing he will outsurvive a team of 5 players almost everytime. In my opinion at least, this goes against the spirit of the game.


Bersekrers who go rambo is because they think rambo can win them games, and stick with the team will kill them. (or they just like to rambo, then perk doesn't matter) You nerf solo/rambo style is also nerfing the chance to survive when sticking with the team. Then what's the reason NOT TO rambo for those people?

I'd say thats actually accetable, because unless he does it fast he has to deal with the FP rage, it will hit him since he is slowed down to Medic speed, and if he is continously raging due to his low health its a case of who hits first. He cannot simply step in, take a swing, balls it up, get hit, heal up and try again. This mistake would cost him vital seconds of dealing damage, which would punish him severely. Its either deal with it perfect, or wind up dead.

And of course returning to your team for help is in the spirit of the game, so I am fine with that too.


Rambos dont really need to go back to the team... break line of sight will make the fleshpound switch target... if they can no longer deal with fps, they just kite them to the team and keep rambo. Those fix is only hurting berserker's team play, and cannot make rambos to go back to their team.

Just like medics who go rambo... "I cant deal with scrakes, what do I do?" "Just ignore them!!! And keep ramboing".
 
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Clearly I'm not judging you man. Also, clearly, test map is GREAT for partise "how to solo" or "how to rambo", but not mutipalyer when you need to stick with the team.

Yeah, you may be extremely good berserker, but your vedio is used as an example for someone to try and proof berserker can "deal with crawlers easily" or something like that.

I clearly not good enough, because I dont even know a way to dual with a single one crawler when I'm facing two scrakes if I dont want my team get eaten by those them. Which happens all the time on mutiplayer. So, I dont know how those pros can do berserker's job well AND not getting hurt (again, not rambo or solo).

A lot of things you learn from playing the Testmap can help you out on the field.

The main point of the video was to help out new players so they can practice things like accuracy, recoil, how the specimens move, attack, etc.

Obviously the gameplay will change online, but that doesn't mean those pieces of advice won't help you online or the situation you face.

I think what J* was trying to explain with the video is that, if you learn all of these small things as a Zerker, you can still be very effective while being on the front lines.
 
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@ 9_6

OK i have to admit that post confused me, and I've gone back and reread everything alot more carefully to try and make more sense of it. Unless I have got this wrong, it seems we are butting heads for no reason. I don't know about you, but I'm getting tired of going round in circles and I think the issue has been that we have both misunderstood the other.

Think of this as a formal apology :)

Explaining my last post:

Spoiler!


I did reanalyse my OP, and change it as the course of the thread went on, as I got more information that aided towards the solution that we both sought. I get the feeling that either I didn't explain that I'd reanalysed my point of view, or it went by unnoticed.

Onto the next point, about relevency.

Spoiler!


Finally looking at your previous post you posted this.

Now let me repeat that I do in fact (to a degree) agree with those changes but for different reasons.
1) The FP axing is more of an exploit than a "tactic".
2) There was no actual need for the zerker speed buff as well as the medic speed nerf.

Spoiler!


So overall, far as i can tell, we have actually been agreeing the whole time on what needs to happen to the Berserker to keep it balanced.

I think the fallout stems from a misunderstanding on your part that I wanted the Berserker to be absolutely forced to stay with his team, while I in turn misinterpretted that you wanted the Berserker to be able to kill everything alone, including Fleshpounds.


So unless I've missed the mark, I'd be willing to let bygones be bygones and just stick with the suggestion: -

- Fix the Fleshpound rage mechanics so that unsuccessful swings do not reset the rage timer, and losing line of sight merely pauses his rage timer instead of resetting it.
- Further make it so the Fleshpound rages continuously at a certain point of health, be it 50%, 33%, 25%, orwhatever. This would affect all kiting classes.
- Make the Zerker no faster than the Medic, whether the Medic is 25% speed on HoE or 20%. If the Medic, who has a real hard time keeping ZEDs off of him doesn't need this speed boost, a class that can punch a hole through and escape with ease sure doesn't need it either.

Unless there is anything you feel would add to this suggestion?
 
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Upvote 0
To Reiterate:

So after all of that, these are the lines you pick out?

So every actual point I made was not worth a mention? and yet
- my not understanding your earlier posts
- a point that is true and yet somehow is false at the same time
- a comment that lacked a dev actually saying "This is why we are nerfing this"
- my motivation for posting, despite the result
were more important that the things that actually refer to the gameplay? This is what I mean by blanking, you've picked all the irrelevant parts and used them to undermine my entire post.


So alright I'll bite.

Spoiler!


So no, I don't see the problem, because you haven't backed up anything that you have said. If you have in earlier posts, would a quote have been too much to ask for?

And seriously if your not challenging the changes I have suggested, why bother picking apart my posts in the first place? Thats why there has been so much confusion, because your challenging things that have no purpose being challenged other than starting a debate over nothing. Honestly its not that far removed from trolling.

@ outofrealman

Why?
Spoiler!



So cheers for actually addressing the issue itself dude, I'm no all knowing god, but I definately feel these changes would only enhance the Killing Floor experience for everyone. Including Berserkers, cause lets face it, winning by exploiting just isn't cool.

Remember if you are working with your team in theory as a Berserker you shouldn't need to deal with Husks, Sirens and crawlers, because someone should be taking them out for you. That was all that video was for.

It was merely the statement "Clearly he hasn't played Berserker" that got up my nostrils, so I too will apologise for possibly overreacting


You will need to CONSTANLY deal with them... because you are standing in the front line... xbow sharpshooters supposed to using 9mm or handcannons, they spot husks or sirens as soon as they spot you. You they attack before the sharpshooter can switch weapon (or support switch from aa12 to hunting shotgun), open the scope, and fire. And this is what happens in my beta play (which most players are good).

The Berserker was always a high skilled class, the problem is by making him more accessible to lower skilled players, it has effectively made pro Berserkers virtually unstoppable, good berserkers very unlikely to get killed, even when alone and mediocre Berserkers able to get away with alot of very sloppy play (i.e. running around in cirles for 20 minutes killing 1 clot every 30 seconds.). The fact he can usually get away with making such mistakes, makes him a the prefferred choice for noobish players, thereby ruining the game experience for everyone else playing HoE.

Even if these changes are only made to HoE, I'd be fine with that, because lets face it, you shouldn't be playing HoE if your only course of action is to kite everything.

Not in HoE dude, 150 specimens as any other perk is pretty much a death sentence, and isn't that what HoE is for? If your teamwork isn't up to it, then your going to lose. Its technically possible sure, but it requires so much luck with the spawns as well as the skill to beat it, its untrue. This simply isn't the case with the Zerker.

Berserkers use his speed to deal with 100+ zeds, supports an sharpshooter use their damage out put to gun their way trough. Good berserkers can win, and good sharpshooters or support can do the same. May be a little bit more difficult. In fact, blinding by husks can already kill you with full health as berserker.

He can, but he is meant to be a hard hitter, he isn't very good against the likes of crawlers and stalkers because they are fast and hard to headshot. Plus he is slow, so its a case of Kill them before they reach you, or die. This is what makes the Sharpshooter balanced

It is funny that when talk about commando or something like that, stalkers and crawelrs is VERY EASY to head shot. When talk about sharpshooters, suddenly they become hard to head shot.

I agree its only small, but it at least keeps specimens in the realm of being able to keep up. As I say the medic gets slowed down by pretty much everything, because its unlikely he will actually kill a specimen, only decap them (so he gets body blocked) or he can get grabbed by clots, or simply just surrounded by stalkers, crawlers and gorefasts.The Berserker doesn't have this issue, since he rarely even gets slowed down. And on the rare occasion he does get surrounded, he can get out again. SImply with his higher speed, he is TOO good at running. Once again he doesn't really get stopped by sloppy play.

Even you make them only have 20% speed bonus, they will still be TOO GOOD at running... just like using ANY perks on hard, its easy to kite, cos you out run everything. And if you dont even give them speed bonus, it sucks reall bad when played properly (stick with the team).

All other classes have to deal with the FP rage, if the Berserker does it right, he doesn't, and thats what is where he has a advantage over everyone else.

Sharpshooters with M14 or demo with M32 dont. Medic also...
Do we really should pay that much attention to rambo or solo play? This game shouldnt be played like that.... you nerf the kiting ability will also affect team play. Solo can be beated by any perk, and again... NOTHING IN THIS WORLD stops rambos. Balance team play is enough already.

He does still have a good chance, as long as the Fleshpounds have already been spawned and dealth with. Plus remember the FP is weaker against grenades, which have been buffed, so the Zerker isn't defenceless against the FP, but it is osmehting that makes him crap his pants... which is a good thing

Clutching it should be something where the team is egging you on to do it because it is hard to do, not something where people see a zerker left and go "Jesus christ here we go again."

Berserker only have 5 nades... and even clots is fast enough to walk far enough to make the "even buffed" granade next to useless. So, you need one to force a fleshpound to change direction, and at least one more to do real damage, and this will rage him without doing any serious damage. As a berserker, axe him or even exchange hits is better...


True, but as we've stated the Berserker is actively encouraged to rambo, because if he knows what he is doing he will outsurvive a team of 5 players almost everytime. In my opinion at least, this goes against the spirit of the game.

Bersekrers who go rambo is because they think rambo can win them games, and stick with the team will kill them. (or they just like to rambo, then perk doesn't matter) You nerf solo/rambo style is also nerfing the chance to survive when sticking with the team. Then what's the reason NOT TO rambo for those people?

I'd say thats actually accetable, because unless he does it fast he has to deal with the FP rage, it will hit him since he is slowed down to Medic speed, and if he is continously raging due to his low health its a case of who hits first. He cannot simply step in, take a swing, balls it up, get hit, heal up and try again. This mistake would cost him vital seconds of dealing damage, which would punish him severely. Its either deal with it perfect, or wind up dead.

And of course returning to your team for help is in the spirit of the game, so I am fine with that too.

Rambos dont really need to go back to the team... break line of sight will make the fleshpound switch target... if they can no longer deal with fps, they just kite them to the team and keep rambo. Those fix is only hurting berserker's team play, and cannot make rambos to go back to their team.

Just like medics who go rambo... "I cant deal with scrakes, what do I do?" "Just ignore them!!! And keep ramboing".

@ 9_6

OK i have to admit that post confused me, and I've gone back and reread everything alot more carefully to try and make more sense of it. Unless I have got this wrong, it seems we are butting heads for no reason. I don't know about you, but I'm getting tired of going round in circles and I think the issue has been that we have both misunderstood the other.

Think of this as a formal apology

Explaining my last post:

Spoiler!


I did reanalyse my OP, and change it as the course of the thread went on, as I got more information that aided towards the solution that we both sought. I get the feeling that either I didn't explain that I'd reanalysed my point of view, or it went by unnoticed.

Onto the next point, about relevency.

Spoiler!


Finally looking at your previous post you posted this.



Spoiler!


So overall, far as i can tell, we have actually been agreeing the whole time on what needs to happen to the Berserker to keep it balanced.

I think the fallout stems from a misunderstanding on your part that I wanted the Berserker to be absolutely forced to stay with his team, while I in turn misinterpretted that you wanted the Berserker to be able to kill everything alone, including Fleshpounds.


So unless I've missed the mark, I'd be willing to let bygones be bygones and just stick with the suggestion: -

- Fix the Fleshpound rage mechanics so that unsuccessful swings do not reset the rage timer, and losing line of sight merely pauses his rage timer instead of resetting it.
- Further make it so the Fleshpound rages continuously at a certain point of health, be it 50%, 33%, 25%, orwhatever. This would affect all kiting classes.
- Make the Zerker no faster than the Medic, whether the Medic is 25% speed on HoE or 20%. If the Medic, who has a real hard time keeping ZEDs off of him doesn't need this speed boost, a class that can punch a hole through and escape with ease sure doesn't need it either.

Unless there is anything you feel would add to this suggestion?
@ 9_6

OK i have to admit that post confused me, and I've gone back and reread everything alot more carefully to try and make more sense of it. Unless I have got this wrong, it seems we are butting heads for no reason. I don't know about you, but I'm getting tired of going round in circles and I think the issue has been that we have both misunderstood the other.

Think of this as a formal apology :)

Explaining my last post:

Spoiler!


I did reanalyse my OP, and change it as the course of the thread went on, as I got more information that aided towards the solution that we both sought. I get the feeling that either I didn't explain that I'd reanalysed my point of view, or it went by unnoticed.

Onto the next point, about relevency.

Spoiler!


Finally looking at your previous post you posted this.



Spoiler!


So overall, far as i can tell, we have actually been agreeing the whole time on what needs to happen to the Berserker to keep it balanced.

I think the fallout stems from a misunderstanding on your part that I wanted the Berserker to be absolutely forced to stay with his team, while I in turn misinterpretted that you wanted the Berserker to be able to kill everything alone, including Fleshpounds.


So unless I've missed the mark, I'd be willing to let bygones be bygones and just stick with the suggestion: -

- Fix the Fleshpound rage mechanics so that unsuccessful swings do not reset the rage timer, and losing line of sight merely pauses his rage timer instead of resetting it.
- Further make it so the Fleshpound rages continuously at a certain point of health, be it 50%, 33%, 25%, orwhatever. This would affect all kiting classes.
- Make the Zerker no faster than the Medic, whether the Medic is 25% speed on HoE or 20%. If the Medic, who has a real hard time keeping ZEDs off of him doesn't need this speed boost, a class that can punch a hole through and escape with ease sure doesn't need it either.

Unless there is anything you feel would add to this suggestion?
 
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To Reiterate:

Do you realize how ridiculously long that is? Or was that the point? It's getting to the point where I can't tell if people are arguing THAT MUCH or just poking fun at the ones that are! Either way, the arguments in this thread have gone almost incoherent and are now just people launching weapons-grade Walls 'O Text at each other.

I can't even try to read a wall of text like that. My eyes...
 
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LOL. I don't even wanna touch this discussion anymore. It's stopped being productive a LONG time ago.

And as you can see above, we've literally reached the point of QUOTES QUOTING QUOTES!

But it's amusing to watch...

Are any threads really "productive"? Very few imo.

Don't make me quote you again Nanostrike :IS2:

I'LL DO IT!!!:eek:
 
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troll imo

Agreed.

My last post was an attempt to get this thread back on track... although I'm still waiting for 9_6's response. So keeping in with that spirit :)

@outofrealman

There are some points I see the arguement, and agree with there, and some parts I don't.

However since this is getting way too long and verbose, I simply would like a quick opinion from the opposing point of view of those game alterations I suggested. WOuld you be happy with them? Opposed? Whatever.

Here if you don't know which I mean:

Spoiler!


Agree? Disagree? Anything to be add or substract?
 
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Agree? Disagree? Anything to be add or substract?

If pounds rage non-stop when nearly dead, only team play will be affected because he dont have much hp on solo.

All these change will only make berserker cannot kite a fleshpound for 15 minutes. And soon they will found if they are the last one, only 5 hits is needed. So problem solved already. And some perks like commando and firebug nearly impossible to kill the fleshpound if they are the last one (or playing solo mode) unless they still have high enough armour. Bacuse thats impossible to prevent the raging and you cannot kill it before it kills you, and you cant run away. (if the team get overrun and you are the last one, you most likely dont even have armour, and on wave 10 you have double pounds spawning to worry about)

I only see berserkers over powered when solo (yeah and medic too, speed is the real issue, not anything else). That's really easy. And being the best perk to solo have nothing wrong. We have a solo mode anyways. And that should be beatable. And most people play mutiplayer, and in mutiplayer, I dont see the overpower factors (ok, unless the full team is medic or berserker... especially on patty's fight).

Dont encourage players to give up is my only requess. And I dont mind to reduce the speed.
 
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Before the balance, the two classes that always kited 100+ specimens after the team was dead were medic and zerker.

After the balance, the two classes that always kite the 100+ specimens after the team is dead are the medic and zerker.

At least we've got consistency. :]

also, @jester: Hugs for everyone!
 
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J*, I have to take issue with you repeatedly calling Flesh Pound meleeing an "exploit", and by extension everyone who does it an "exploiter". Even though I do think it's too easy to perform right now, it is still, technically speaking, a legitimate tactic - for better or worse, the code that governs it is working as intended. You not liking it doesn't make it cheating. Looking for ways to address balance issues is productive, but calling people cheaters when they aren't is not.

Anyway, I have a completely different take on the issue, and I doubt we'll ever agree on what the best approach is. I've already stated my views, and I doubt reiterating them will accomplish anything, so I'll just ask you this: Why, of all things, do you think the damage resistance buff should stay? I think that in particular sums the difference between our approaches pretty well: I want to increase the Berserker's dependence on skill, whereas you want to reduce the benefits of having it. Why is that?
 
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J*, I have to take issue with you repeatedly calling Flesh Pound meleeing an "exploit", and by extension everyone who does it an "exploiter". Even though I do think it's too easy to perform right now, it is still, technically speaking, a legitimate tactic - for better or worse, the code that governs it is working as intended. You not liking it doesn't make it cheating. Looking for ways to address balance issues is productive, but calling people cheaters when they aren't is not.

Anyway, I have a completely different take on the issue, and I doubt we'll ever agree on what the best approach is. I've already stated my views, and I doubt reiterating them will accomplish anything, so I'll just ask you this: Why, of all things, do you think the damage resistance buff should stay? I think that in particular sums the difference between our approaches pretty well: I want to increase the Berserker's dependence on skill, whereas you want to reduce the benefits of having it. Why is that?

Damage resistance doesn't equal skill required. Damage resistance, combined with the speed boost, and his weapons not requiring ammo, are the rewards the Berserker gets for not having the insane firepower or wicked AoE attacks the majority of the other classes can dish out at a safe distance.

If you start taking away from those advantages, you start making the Berserker a lot less attractive (And IMO, less fun to play) than the other classes. Simple as that.

A melee attack that can only hit 1 enemy at a time is pretty shabby compared to Grenade Launchers that can level groups, Shotguns that can instantly clear hallways, Crossbows that can 1-shot stuff a mile away, Flamethrowers that can toast whole rooms, and SCARs that pop the heads off anything in sight.


Medics are almost the same as the Berserker, but instead of the melee bonuses, they get massive teammate and self-healing bonuses, insanely strong armor, and a VERY SLIGHTLY lessened speed bonus that applies with all weapons instead of melee. They're still the fastest moving class in the game with guns and that alone is a huge advantage.

If the medic's speed being reduced by 5% is really that crippling, give it back. I could care less. But the Zerker is in a pretty balanced spot right now and IMO, doesn't need any adjustment.


All this "FP Rage makes X perk broken because of X" nonsense is another discussion entirely and I'm not sure why it has page upon page dedicated to it. We should be focusing on more important things...like how much the M14 sucks.
 
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@Entangler
Good luck convincing people it's not an exploit. I've posted why it isn't an exploit but everyone except Xebo seems to have just ignored it.
http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showpost.php?p=693859&postcount=196

Entangler and I both helped Xienen fix parts of the rage code. We know how the code governs the FP behavior and it's working as intended.

Damage resistance doesn't equal skill required. Damage resistance, combined with the speed boost, and his weapons not requiring ammo, are the rewards the Berserker gets for not having the insane firepower or wicked AoE attacks the majority of the other classes can dish out at a safe distance.

Um..what? A level 6 zerker can dish out up to 687 damage with an axe and 451 with katana. That alone is enough to 1 shot 7 speciments on 6 man HoE. Double those values if you get your back stab which lets you 3 shot a 6 man HoE scrake. I fail to see how that qualifies as not having "insane firepower". Even if you can only hit 1 specimen as a time, the swing speed combined with the movement speed of a level 6 zerker is fast enough to safely take on multiple targets.
 
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J*, I have to take issue with you repeatedly calling Flesh Pound meleeing an "exploit", and by extension everyone who does it an "exploiter".

I started that because it was regarded as a "skill" of the berserker, thus it is okay to nerf the berserker because it is a berserker thing. Berserker.
You're exploiting the fact that there is a 2 second rage reset timer.
That is so obscure and counter-intuitive, you'll probably never find out about that on your own.
You know, like an exploit. Or a "trick" if you prefer that.

Most people in this forum probably didn't even know how to do it until someone (who probably looked at the code to find that loophole *hint hint*) came in here and explained how it worked, and even then people were all like "lol, meleeing pounds? Never" but now it's suddenly treated as if it is and has always been the most common knowledge in kf ever.

Now correct me if I'm wrong but the loading screen states that, to deal with pounds, we should "use big guns".
It doesn't say that if they do a certain attack, they bow down and during that specific animation, you can 1-hit decap them with pretty much any weapon, it also doesn't say we should annoy them to death by hammering an axe into their skull, waiting 2 seconds, rinse and repeat.
Thus I said it should be treated more like an exploit than a "feature" cause pounds seem to be the main point people keep and keep whining about when complaining that the zerker is "OP".
 
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