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I want all human slots for tanks.

the fact is that you can only have 3 humans per tank period, regardless of how many available slots there are in that tank that you can actually fill. so whoever is saying "i'd like to crew all 5 spots with my clanmates" etc... that's just not going to happen.

as for the ability to let players crew every single position in the tank, would it "hurt" to let players be the loader if they really want to? probably not, but is it worth TW's time to make it possible just so that .001% of RO players who'd actually like to play as a loader get the chance? imo, no it isn't.

if there's 10 people who really, REALLY want to play "loader", just make a mutator ;)
 
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the fact is that you can only have 3 humans per tank period, regardless of how many available slots there are in that tank that you can actually fill. so whoever is saying "i'd like to crew all 5 spots with my clanmates" etc... that's just not going to happen.

as for the ability to let players crew every single position in the tank, would it "hurt" to let players be the loader if they really want to? probably not, but is it worth TW's time to make it possible just so that .001% of RO players who'd actually like to play as a loader get the chance? imo, no it isn't.

if there's 10 people who really, REALLY want to play "loader", just make a mutator ;)

What about the German tanks separate commander? That was one of the Germans main advantages over the T34.
 
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What about the German tanks separate commander? That was one of the Germans main advantages over the T34.

that would be unbalanced :rolleyes:.

Anyway i agree even if the loader is not playable (what hapens when he dies?) i want the other 4 spots be be controlled at the same time. To anyone that thinks the mgunner position would be useless, see if you say that when someone is killed and you have no one spare to take his place.


the fact is that you can only have 3 humans per tank period, regardless of how many available slots there are in that tank that you can actually fill. so whoever is saying "i'd like to crew all 5 spots with my clanmates" etc... that's just not going to happen.

oh well if that is the case then we should not even bother telling TW what we want, if it cant be then i atleast would like to know why they will not give us the option
 
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I want every position, including the loader to be playable in the game

I am wondering why somebody makes this suggestion again?
there was already a thread about that a while ago, and it was turned down the same way like here.

Its also on the "Best of suggestions" thread for months! (in the Turned down section of course) :rolleyes:
 
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I am wondering why somebody makes this suggestion again?
there was already a thread about that a while ago, and it was turned down the same way like here.

Its also on the "Best of suggestions" thread for months! (in the Turned down section of course) :rolleyes:

Well we should atleast be able to have separate commander and gunner, maybe the loader is far fetched and could just be a mod for realism units.
 
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Now if you want to be rediculously realistic when it comes to tanks is to have German tanks (I won't say this about Soviet tanks because I am unaware) turrets be slow to move, they were hand cranked unlike the sherman electrical rotating turret, that's why when the equation Sherman + 50 meter radius + open field = domination of the german tanks, "I hit you in the rear, oh donkey poo your turret is about to turn all the way to hit me... driver move up 10 meters... haha you have 5 more seconds (or however) to adjust your turret again.... Now if the Germans were a skilled team, they could easily over power but since it usually wasn't 1v1 (the tactic would be move the entire tank so the turret has faster rotation) turning your rear to a sherman in front, rear, side = you're screwed.... :D

Sorry but you're completely wrong. Most German tanks featured either electric or hydraulic powered turret traverse, and their turret traverse was generally just as fast as the Sherman's.

Only very early Panzers such as the Pz.III featured manual traverse, and even then it wasn't that slow thanks to some niftly designed cranking gears.
 
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After getting and reading my PC gamer magazine article on ROHOS I noticed one line in particular. The one where the interviewer mentions how your SOL when your loader gets killed because nobody can take his place. Now I assume that other AI will be orderable into that postion. But lets just say for devils advocate reasons that you have a tank with 4 humans in it and your loader dies but the tank is completely fine and in running condition. How 'fun' and 'realistic' is it for everyone else (including hull MG) to sit there with their thumb's up their buts because they cant load the gun. We are already allowing people to switch positions in a tank and perform something they may not have been trained in, so dont tell me its because they dont know how to load the gun. Even if its implemented in a very simplistic manner, humans taking over the AI loader HAS to be in game.

It's like giving the MG shutze a AI assitant to load the gun and feed the belts, then when he gets killed, magically the human player just cant load his gun himself and must sit there begging to be shot / suicide in order to again play the game. Even as I am writing this I can imagine the forum rage posts about something like that being in game.

RO gave players options so they could adapt to changing situations, it was part of the fun of the game; being required to think on the rare occasion. Why tie up players hands behind thier backs and say no, in this one particular case you will not be allowed to adapt, suck it up buttercup. Thats like making a sniper game, and advertising about how you could go anwywhere and snipe your enemies, then making all the church towers inaccessible....


grr * rage over *
 
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Sorry but you're completely wrong. Most German tanks featured either electric or hydraulic powered turret traverse, and their turret traverse was generally just as fast as the Sherman's.

Only very early Panzers such as the Pz.III featured manual traverse, and even then it wasn't that slow thanks to some niftly designed cranking gears.
So the history channel lied to me? *puppy-dog face with tears out of its eyes and a bunch of snot comming out of the nose*
 
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alright guys, long time forum stalker coming online.

1. the tank has 5 AI manned spots. Driver, MG, Gunner, loader, Commander.
the Russian tanks have only 4 AI manned spots: driver, MG, Loader, Gunner/commander

2. there are 3 Player "ghosts" in both Tank variants, they "possess" the AI.
when an AI is killed and can't man a Position, the Player Possessed Character needs to physically Move.

Conclusion = German tanks have instant switch between Gunner and Commander.
Russian Tank needs 1-2 seconds to switch, as the Gunner needs to physically switch location.
= a realistic ingame advantage for the germans.
... but of course you can always Shoot the Commander when he's looking out the hatch. evening the advantage.

3. the loader is 100% AI controlled and basically Eyecandy. if you would control the Loader you would not be able to do anything, as the Loading is automated. oh, maybe you could look out some slits...

4. I prefer less, really awesome looking, feeling, balanced, high quality tanks than 10 lesser quality ones which are a pain to balance, and 7 won't be used as they are inferiour. Panzer II for example. or KV-1. but I can imagine their use in very early maps..

5. now, I figured out some things.
what if the Tank is fully manned with 3 players, and 2 want to switch places? in a russian tank? the Loader position could be used there as a place switching "parking lot"

5.1 alternatively, I coul imagine a system of request. the Driver wants the gunnery slot. so he presses F2 or 2. he doesn't switch, but when the position opens he'll move there. he shouts something up, and the Gunner hears it and gets a notification "Driver wants to gun". now the Gunner could press F1, or 1, and they switch places.

6. what will happen when the loader is killed? I can imagine that the character in the Gunner position moves to the gunner slot automatically after every shot and loads himself, then returns to the Gunnery position and fires.

7. what if the Loader is killed, but you have your commander AI still alive?
what if you could switch to the commander, and move him physically to take the loader seat? same with the MG position.

when looking at these tactical choices, I think the Loader slot should be "manable".
however, no minigames. you won't be able to do anything, and it would mainly be used to replace a dead Loader.
if I see that our Loader is Killed, and I'm the third person on the MG, I would move my character to the loader seat, just to help see outside and help out our gunner. I would be stuck there, or I could move back to the MG, but then the Gunner needs to switch places every shot, slowing down our rate of fire by half, if not more.
and to stop griefers, the gunner position would be manned when he's reloading "manually", or else a dickhead driver or MG could steal his position while he's in the loader seat.
 
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Colt .45, if the loader dies, there are no more A.Is and the commander orders a human to take over the loader position then:

that human loses control of his character and goes into the respawn queue while the character is taken over by a.i.

If there is just one human left in the tank, he shoots and loads by himself.
 
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Colt .45, if the loader dies, there are no more A.Is and
that human loses control of his character and goes into the respawn queue while the character is taken over by a.i.

that is problematic, I think, as maybe after you destroyed an enemy tank, but face infantry, it would make more sense to switch to the Hull MG instead of the loader. (coaxial MG doesn't need Loader last I checked) and you're practically suiciding, which is a negative feedback, almost a punishment for helping your Gunner.
of course, you should always have the OPTION to "suicide" in the Loader position.

when the Loader AI is killed the gunner should Reach/crawl around and reload by himself (automatically after every shot?), what would take longer as he has to move around the tank and he can't aim in that time.

however, his gunnery position would stay occupied, and the Loader position will stay open, even if he's on the other side Loading. why? see griefers and Position stealing MG guys.

so...

Yes to Loader position. it adds just too much tactical depth than to restrict it, and is a another AI crewman that can be used to Drive/gun in case the driver/gunner dies.

but keep the Max 3 players in 1 tank rule.
it allows you to switch positions with other players by temporarily changing to Loader, and you can prioritize your manning/resources depending on the situation. MG or loader? instant commander switch or faster firing?

all this would only really apply when a crewmember or Human dies and it is necessary to use the position.

anyway, does anybody know that if your "possessed" AI dies, you respawn back at base, or do you auto switch to the next free AI crewmember?
 
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Colt .45, if the loader dies, there are no more A.Is and the commander orders a human to take over the loader position then:

that human loses control of his character and goes into the respawn queue while the character is taken over by a.i.

If there is just one human left in the tank, he shoots and loads by himself.

Is that confirmed? My biggest worry is that the tank will be useless after the loader gets shot?

Slightly off topic for this, but how does crew respawning work? will someone be able to be a survivor in a tank, and then take over an ai in a respawned tank with the rest of their crew later? Or will they then become an solo-crew? And on combined arms, Im slightly confused, will there be a set number of tanks(up to 3ppl per tank) or tankers(like in RO), with the possibility of greater numbers of tanks?
 
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I think we will find these details out with upcoming ingame videos or, very late, the demo. or the full release when there's no demo.

I think the biggest fear is that a Loader dies and we have no means to compensate for that loss, thus are stuck with a tank that only has 2 MGs as armament, and damaged by the round that penetrated and killed the loader in the first place.

Personally I want three things:

1. let us move an AI crewmember to the Loader spot when the Loader is killed.

2. a simple system that allows two players to swap places in the tank when the accidentally wind up in positions they are not accustomed too/don't want to play.

3. when there is no Loader, Make the Gunner reload slower, and manually.


a way to implement Number 3 would be that after firing a shot, you would press R, you would go away from the optics, crawl over to the Loader's side, and reload on your own, then go back. this would not change your Gunnery slot.
 
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I want every position, including the loader to be playable in the game, while certainly most people would not want to be a loader, or an MG/radio guy on a tank only map, I just like the option, and realism units would LOVE IT!

Also, I'm really upset that the German tank commander/gunner are the same person, even if they switch between two different characters, I think this is the main advantage of German tanks that theres a seperate pair of eyes, and its actually one of the main advantages of the German tanks over the Russian tanks.

For CA maps I imagine theres a fixed number of tanks, and you could have as many crew as you want, while on tank only maps, it could be an advantage/disadvantage, for example 10 fully manned German tanks vs 32 1 manned Russian tanks.

...........Seriously, you want someone to just sit and click to load the ammo? The most boring and stupid spot that is no fun at all...you see no combat or anything...Jesus, by all means I'll let you play that spot but while you're doing it try not to die of pure Fun. I mean seriously with a spot that intense and energetic you might overdose on adrenaline. My thoughts, not that I care if you care nor if you respond, but TWI know's what they're doing, let them do it.
 
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Colt .45, if the loader dies, there are no more A.Is and the commander orders a human to take over the loader position then:

that human loses control of his character and goes into the respawn queue while the character is taken over by a.i.

If there is just one human left in the tank, he shoots and loads by himself.


great, force suicided out of your own tank as a bandaid fix for someone having to load a bloody gun?

Does NO ONE understand teamwork? When a team succeeds in some objective the whole team is responsible and takes the credit as a team, even though one person may have been responsible for the actual success, however without the team they would never have achieved the success. In video game laymans terms that means that while some positions in tank may be 'boring' when considered all by themselves, even that position would be fun when with a good team and kicking arse.

Edit: I will add here that I used to drive a LOT for mates when we played on OREL, I probably spent more time driving then I did gunning ( dedicated driving in a full tank). And driving is just sitting there and pushing buttons, you dont get to see too much, you dont get to shoot.. its really boring, we should take out driving... yknow make tanks all 1 position with an external view and all...

@3 men to 1 tank: I hope to heck this is not confirmed, and is not true.
As someone else said in a different post today, asymetrical ballance, give the germans one extra man in a tank, and give the russians a few more tanks, and then ask people to actually THINK in order to win. IMO ROOST had some of the best ballance around ( except for those lame tank maps that gave the russians arse loads of 1 hit kill mod made tanks isntead of real ratios )

Why should all posistions be mannable?

Well one of the best distinctions of this game is the attnetion to detail and the small subtle things you might not notice but that just fit. Manual bolting, the cover system so far, actual ballistic system, ETC. This would just be another one of those small niche things that makes the game a bit more interesting...
 
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Semi-Off topic...

yes, most tanks ( if not all in RO2 time frame ) will be hand cranked and relatively slow. However, some of the tanks ( like the PZIV ) are both hand crank and electric.
Electric for moving the turret in wide sweeps, and hand crank for fine adjustments.

Most tank turret rotations in the original RO are far to fast ( fast as a modern tank ), and only the Tiger 1 has a realistic turret speed...Oh, and the IS2 is unrealistically to fast.

Joe
 
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What would be cool is if the Commander could use the mouse to highlight something on his screen, and then after a several second delay (to approximate the time it would take to inform the gunner), that highlight appears on the gunner's screen. So as a Commander you could be constantly scanning for enemies and objects to destroy and highlighting them for your gunner, who would focus on getting good, accurate shots on all of them, and who could be focusing his entire time on shooting rather than having to switch out into a Commander role.

Of course, if there is no one currently occupying a slot, you should be able to toggle which open position you are using at any time. So if it's just you and the driver, you should indeed have to switch between Commander and Gunner.

As for the Loader, to me that's just gratuitous. There's no way you could make that fun enough to warrant the player slot it would take up from the server; I'd rather the player who would be thusly employed mindlessly shoving shells into the gun be elsewhere on the server, providing a more meaningful interaction with the ongoing battle, be it by operating other tanks or just contributing to the ground forces at large.
 
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