Why Do Axis Win at a Higher Rate Than Allies?
- Thread starter Dubzinator
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Could it be that an incredible gun used across a large segment of the team provides a larger benefit to the whole team due to the incredible features of the aforementioned gun?
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For those of you who need a quick history lesson during this period of the war the soviets were caught off guard by the axis invasion of russia...Stalin simply did not believe hitler would try fend off allies from both sides so the allies were at a dis advantage... stalin would have been commanding the soviet army against various axis attacks... he proved to be a shockingly bad commander and many of the battles he saw over were lost to the allies...stalingrad was one of the bigger achievements for the germans during Operation barborrosa which was hitlers tactic for crushing russias industry ... although many see it as the big turning point for the war at one point the nazis controlled over 90% of the city!!! the reason for this wall of text is because i dont think the axis majority in winnings is because of over powered guns or what tanks the axis have its because the maps are designed so that the russians are at a slight dis advantage on some maps which can be over come with good team work... the russians were very dis organised during this battle so i think the effect of the map design is totally intentional by the devs!!! hehe that rant went on for way longer than i hoped 
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Its not the Axis, its the Allies.
The reason Allies generally lose is because most maps Allies are the on the offensive, and SL doesn't properly utilize smoke.
Its really that simple.
When smoke IS thrown, 2 or 3 people move in through it, while the other 20 players on the team sit back and do absolutely nothing.
On maps where the German's attack they often get stonewalled just as hard.
The reason Allies generally lose is because most maps Allies are the on the offensive, and SL doesn't properly utilize smoke.
Its really that simple.
When smoke IS thrown, 2 or 3 people move in through it, while the other 20 players on the team sit back and do absolutely nothing.
On maps where the German's attack they often get stonewalled just as hard.
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This I can agree on. It's the skill and experience base of the players that is the problem. People just like the German gear. It looks cooler, even if it doesn't work better. So on average the better set of players will be Aixs simply because most people seem to want to play as Axis.
I was laughing my *** off last night at the guy who played round after round as a German with the MkB moaning about how unbalanced it was.
He chose to use it but then complained how many there were, and never even noticed that he was a major part of the problem. He didn't care if he was actually being effective with it, he saw other players getting kills with it and wasn't going to miss out on that action.
The reality is, the gun is good for noobs. It helps hide their bad tactics and will save their *** if they get in a bind. Most of the time. That won't last long. Once the hype wears off and the better players return to the better weapons, you'll barely even see it.
Just like when people were screaming about how the MG 34 had too much recoil... until they started learning how to handle it... and now you barely hear anything about them. Now it's the MkB. It's been the MP40, the PPSh, the MG 34 ,the DP-28, the Mosin Nagant and the K98.
At one point or another every single weapon in the game has been called both over and under powered. The only difference was how many times the person complaining had been able to kill with it, or had been killed by it. There was NEVER any evidence that the guns were objectively faulty.
There still isn't. There may be too much of them, but that's because everyone wants to use them. What most people who complain want is for everyone ELSE to not be allowed to use them. They never willingly refuse to use them themselves.
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Probably this. Because of lethality of weapons in this game, defenders who can setup on proper vantage point can be tough to clear out without use of good covers. The map obviously won't give you a trench line that will take you all the way to the objective, so using smoke properly is critical in surviving those few open areas that you inevitably have to cross.
For example, Station, Spartanovka and Grain Elevator can all be dominated pretty hardcore by decent Russian team. They don't have to play crazy good. As long as key defensive classes like MGs aren't filled by complete morons, Axis will have tough time breaking through.
Exact opposite for Apartment, Red October Factory and Commissar's House. Well especially for Commissar's House, my goodness Germans can totally lock down Russians on their own spawn because how easily defensible that first red house is (forgot if it was A or B).
Well Red October Factory and Station are not that terrible actually, because of wide width of attack vectors and plenty of obstacles to advance under cover.
Then there is Pavlo's House, which I think favors Germans a bit because of how their starting building covers both Russian buildings and is protected by smoke/lightshaft effect.
Perhaps it's equal for two highly skilled teams, but assuming pug game of pug caliber players, it's certainly easier for people to just camp and pick of the enemies that run at you.
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That the Germans were the attacking team. Attackers naturally get more team points than defenders. The only way the opposite could happen would be if the attacking team got shutout on the first caps.
I personally only notice heavy loss ratios on certain maps that are actually biased. Commissar's House, Danzig, Pavlov's House, and Red Oktober Factory being big ones. Most people say that tactics and "skill"* win these maps, really, it's luck -
Commissar's House - To win this as Russia, several things are required. The first, and biggest, is that the Germans don't pull out a PIV. A single PIV can completely shutdown Park North with little fear, due to the only flanking move requires a T34 to get close to the German infantry spawn. You could say that the T34 could weaken the PIV's front armor and kill it that way, but that takes too long and you lose too many reinforcements. Plus, if the German team pulls out BOTH PIV's, just let the timer run out, because you're simply not going to win. Another requirement is that the German commander doesn't call artillery right outside Russian spawn 1. When that happens, that spawn becomes basically useless, and you're funneled. The last one I have in mind, is you gotta hope that their Marksman has a bad ping, or is just a bad Marksman. From personal experience, if their Marksman has a good ping, he can completely shutdown the field between Building B1 and whatever the German cap is from the Projection House. Without a tank, that Marksman is extremely hard to dislodge aswell.
Danzig - All Russian players can do here is pray that a lone wolf can sprint into Propaganda House from one of the sides and pick off the six guys watching the basement. Then hope that their are enough surviving Russians in said basement to run up and clear the upstairs BEFORE the stairway "defenders" get back with their MP40s and MkBs. Then hope, again, that a bunch of Park defenders run over to try to recap the House. Danzig requires a surreal amount of luck.
Pavlov's House - Aslong as the Germans don't pull out their PIVs, it should be fairly easy to defend. The moment the PIVs start rolling, you have a similar situation to that of Commissar's House.
Red Oktober Factory - The map speaks for itself. All the Russians can hope for is that half of the German team is AFK.
About the "Experienced players go German" stuff. That is total BS. German players in WW2 Online try to say the same thing. It's a little known fact that the "Superior German everything" stereotype is very well recognized, and along with the "Bad guy" thing, it influences new players more than anything else. I could almost bet that the only reason some new players go Russian is because Germany is always stacked.
*Side Note - Skill doesn't exist in video games, only Knowledge.
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On most maps the Germans blend in with the surroundings were as the Russians stand out.
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I think t34 tankers are just unskilled right now. I am for the same vital points that were in ro1 and they still work. I killed 4 pzIVs last night in one life in a t34. At close ranges by shooting the frontal armor. It took one shoot each, even the german tankers were surprised. It was the night time map Red October Factory, on the 2fmj realism server,. I am unhappy about the whole mp40II and mkb BS but I think the tanks are fine.
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It tells me that half of the Russians aren't even shooting from the cap or at people in it to begin with. You get points if you kill an enemy in the cap, or if you're standing in it when you kill one. You even get points if you're standing in the cap when you lose it. You even get the multiplier for being in the cap when it's lost.
The Germans almost always have a higher teamwork score, regardless of whether they're attacking or defending. They're correctly focusing on the objectives and making far more points doing it. I swear on Spartanovka, half the Russian team will fight from behind the cap and maybe shoot one German, while the rest creep up through cover without being seen.
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Agree in just one thing.
Smarter players go in Axiss. Cos they a better... And most of players want always to win. Want better stats also.. Germans have better weapons, also better positions in most of maps...
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So the Nazi-worshipping here goes so far as to worship the players playing fictionalized Nazis as "better" and "just more organized"?
Erm, no. The gear is better and, given as random a selection of players as possible, the maps often favor them. Plain and simple.
Erm, no. The gear is better and, given as random a selection of players as possible, the maps often favor them. Plain and simple.
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Where the hell did you read in my post that I was moaning? I just pointed out that is it pretty stupid to analyze pub games in this manner, because a typical pub game is just a bunch of random and usually terrible players running about like lemmings, so any tactics people here so like discussing just don't happen outside clan matches. And even if somebody tries, they usually fail due to their incompetence and random nature of the game. So normally the team consisting of player that shoot better or rush the cap better wins, as long as the map and sides are balanced. But if, on average, one side is winning a lot more than the other side, it means that side has an advantage.
Also, judging by how much importance you put into your success at pub games, I can deduce that you are probably pretty bad yourself (an average pub hero most likely) based on empirical evidence collected over the years. So quit acting like you understand the game and flooding the forums with your clueless ramblings, there is enough of that stuff around here already.
Also, capitalizing random words is bad style.
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Maybe when people start unlocking the drum magazines for the PPSH41 the Russians will start winning more. Didn't read through all these posts someone might have brought this up. I'm lazy.
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So like I posted, unless the defenders shutout the attackers on the first cap, the attackers should naturally have more team points than defenders. When you cap a point, it means you had more players in the zone than the defenders, which means that less defenders get points for losing it.
There is a few reasons for this, and I'll tell you why. A German commander can mortar the church, and it'll kill most of the players inside, even though they're inside the church. That is one of the prime reasons some players avoid it. Another is that the Russians have to cover three spots on the map to hold at the church, two of them arn't in the cap zone. These are the Russian right flank and left flank. If no one covers both of these points, then due to the lack of a protected zone, German players can either go up behind the church through the village, or even spawn camp the Russians. We don't have many options for the church.
When it comes to the village itself, this is the only place the Russians don't have a good excuse for. It is hard to defend simply because it's perfect for the MP40 and MkB, but even if you lose the first line, the population behind should be enough to hold for a bit longer.
The Town Hall is just like the church, but worse. The German commander can call mortars right behind the town hall, which I think is BS because of how close to spawn it is. Plus the mortars force the Russians that want to get into town hall to take the streets, which is suicide.
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If I understand things correctly eventually when players reach Hero status they have access to all weapons on either side for their class. So at that point people can only blame maps an tanks. I don't think its the tanks.
Also in a lot of cases I agree that in general the attacking side loses. Even if its the Germans. Even on close quarters combat maps like Barracks. All you need is half competent defenders. Where as on the attacker side you need genuine teamwork tactics. Smoke must be thrown an then people have to actually use it an rush into those points in a big enough group that one or two defenders can't just kill them. But that rarely happens. Instead upsets usually occur from lone wolves getting lucky flanks. An then finally the camping attackers gain some courage an move towards the point when they see it flashing colors.
Also in a lot of cases I agree that in general the attacking side loses. Even if its the Germans. Even on close quarters combat maps like Barracks. All you need is half competent defenders. Where as on the attacker side you need genuine teamwork tactics. Smoke must be thrown an then people have to actually use it an rush into those points in a big enough group that one or two defenders can't just kill them. But that rarely happens. Instead upsets usually occur from lone wolves getting lucky flanks. An then finally the camping attackers gain some courage an move towards the point when they see it flashing colors.
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So why not make realistic number of players on each side then? And realistic number of tanks. How about realistic amount of artillery for the russians vs the germans!?
Wanna know how that would end?
You use realism like you know anything about it from playing videogames... sigh...
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I usually play as Axis, but when I play as the Allies I notice something. They generally have much worse teamwork. Barely any communication, no support and bad SLs. There was one game though when I was playing on Red October Factory as the Axis when the Allies actually used teamwork and won the game. I do agree that the PzIV is better than the T34, but if they work together and coordinate strikes with both tanks and AT-infantry it should be easy. In the case of the Mkb and the MP40 being far superior weapons to the Avt and the Ppsh, I have to disagree. There's been several cases where both me and my teammates have been outgunned by people with Avt/Ppsh. Summarized, the problem is not that the game is unbalanced, it's people refusing to work together as a team.
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