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PBBans supports Red Orchestra 2

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#281
As for this:

Were you just throwing that out there without actually knowing what it means, or do you have some sort of understanding of these 'requirements'? If so, please share.
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Microsoft has quite a few programs that usually run with Punkbuster. It hasn't been until recently, that MS has decided to change a bunch of things in their new OS's to make PB run harder. With Windows XP or before, the OS and PB were hand-in-hand. Now with Windows Vista and Windows 7, there are a bunch of things that PB needed to update in order for it to work smoothly. And now with Windows 8 Beta, they will have to update it further.

As to why PB thinks that is a concern, well, I don't know. You would have to ask them since they created the software.
 
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#283
Vintage said:
From my experience, Punk Buster isn't very good. Every server I join on Bad Company 2 will have atleast one hacker on it. Unless they have done something to change how their system works I am very skeptical about PB being on RO2.
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No anticheat software catches every single hack out there. That would be almost impossible as most private cheats are updated daily/weekly.
 
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#284
So PBBans is only for confirmed cases of cheating and not simple mistakes right? I've only been kicked by PB once and that was because I had been programming earlier in the day and I left the DirectX debug runtime enabled when I started America's Army. PB detected that and kicked me (I think it specifically said debug runtime in the report). I wouldn't be perma-banned by PBBans for something simple like that, right?
 
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#285
Tweek said:
So PBBans is only for confirmed cases of cheating and not simple mistakes right? I've only been kicked by PB once and that was because I had been programming earlier in the day and I left the DirectX debug runtime enabled when I started America's Army. PB detected that and kicked me (I think it specifically said debug runtime in the report). I wouldn't be perma-banned by PBBans for something simple like that, right?
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I doubt it
 
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#286
As far as i can see with any software, from any company it boils down to trust.

Microsoft make the OS you use and you trust them enough to use it, and store your personal information on the computer.

TWI are giving us RO2 and you trust them enough to use their software on this same computer.

Valve gave us steam and VAC and we trust that company enough to allow these things to run on the same computer.

And most of us really have no idea what they could be collecting from us.

What you need to do is ask yourself, after doing some research on the company EvenBalance. If you trust them enough not to use the information collected for anything other than anti cheat.
Given that this is how they make their money, it would not be a good idea to abuse this trust now would it ?

Personally I think punkbuster is a great addition to VAC. And pbbans just makes the job of keeping the cheats of all the servers easier.

I have used both with no issues and will only play on PB enabled servers.


But the decision is up to the individual.
 
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#287
After this -
HellBilly said:
im not making anything up
your implying that those who use PB are as much noobs as those that like relaxed realisim
its very clear
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And now this -
HellBilly said:
havent you heard
!!! all the great business models are using personal info
to steal things. its the IN thing to do !!! ever since the enron and bernie madoff.

your company will not be successful untill your in court with primtime network news coverage

sidenote .. nobody cares about your porn files
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..it's quite clear you're a really small minded guy. Do me a favor and keep your PB zealotry and your personal attacks to yourself. I hope a moderator does something the next time this guy doesnt think before he posts. I'm asking valid questions and remaining respectful the entire time. I'm not bashing PB or PBBans, or any individual in the least bit.. so please keep this guy in check.
 
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#288
REZ said:
Wow, so you guys come in and attack me for having concerns? Bravo. Don't waste your time. I'm not the 'bad guy' because I'm still unsure about PB. Try as you may.
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sounds like you've already made up your mind
At this point I think I'm going to try and stick to servers with good admins running VAC only as it's always been sufficient for RO1 (I don't know what kind of choices I'll have, but hopefully I'll have a few). The reason for this is because the gameplay in RO is such that unless a player has a hack that allows him to either shoot through walls or never miss a shot, then any other type of hack doesnt really help much. I don't really care if a player can see me through walls or have me on some kind of radar because the bottom line is.. he still has to kill me, and that's easier said than done. If a guy is running a hack that makes it so he never misses or can shoot through walls, then an admin will catch that sort of thing really quick.
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your slow talking this thread to death and putting a bad taste in ohter forum members mouths against punkbuster

i dont need a mod to tell me to shut it
im done
the cheaters will convince anyone that has any doubts
to join a PB for a cleaner game
 
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#289
Vintage said:
From my experience, Punk Buster isn't very good. Every server I join on Bad Company 2 will have atleast one hacker on it. Unless they have done something to change how their system works I am very skeptical about PB being on RO2.
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keep in mind pb - like any current Anti-Cheat System - is a reactive software. A good analogy is virus .vs. AV.

As well the countermeasures for public cheats are somewhat different to these for leaked private cheats, the price to get rid of all 'paying customers' is to leave them alone while logging them.
 
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#290
HellBilly said:
your slow talking this thread to death and putting a bad taste in ohter forum members mouths against punkbuster
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This is what I'm talking about. You sit there and imply that I have some ulterior motive just because I'm asking questions and raising concerns.. and I don't appreciate that. Then, it bothers you so much that you come in here and start insulting me. My questions and comments come from having no experience with PB whatsoever, so I don't see how that's going to influence someone else who is perfectly capable of making their own decision. Just back off. We know you like PB.
 
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#292
No, there's no grudge match. There's someone who wants some clarification and someone else who gets upset by that. A moderator would do wonders here.

I'd still like to know, from Yosh or another TWI staff member the answer to this question -

So, Yoshiro.. I have a question for you.

In order for a server to be ranked or allow players therein to complete 'achievements' will the server need to have PunkBuster running? If an admin chooses not to run PunkBuster, can the players there still gain achievements, stat tracking, leveling etc?
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Will a VAC only server allow for achievements, leveling, ranking, stat tracking etc. ..basically all of the things a PB server has?
 
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#295
I read and re-read hat very carefully and no where in there does it say that information from a computer which has punkbuster installed , that any files or information will be shared with an actual third party company (which you are, you are not Evenballance), but rather it says;

Licensee understands and agrees that the information that may be inspected and reported by PunkBuster software includes, but is not limited to, Licensee's Internet Protocol Address, devices and any files residing on the hard-drive and in the memory of the computer on which PunkBuster software is installed. Licensee acknowledges and agrees that if Licensee does not want Licensor to collect and process such information, Licensee should not use the PunkBuster software.
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.

Please note the bolded word "licensor". This is evenballance, not PBBANS. When you agree to the EULA, your agreeing to allow Evenballance to collect this information , not PBBANNS. The difference is a legally binding contract with accountability under said agrement(EULA) with Evenballance (not PBBANNS) that a "licensee" agrees to when installing Punkbuster. Without a Licensee directly agreeing to the same with you , you have no legal right...period.

Unless of course your under licence with Evenballance to do so. If thats the case its public domain, and you can simply post that licence information here and settle this. Other than that your SW is simply a mod collecting information of others computers for the use of penal action against them without any accountability.

Dont get me wrong. The intention is a noble one. But there is a right way and a wrong way about going about doing things. If your are under legal license ,with the same legal accountability,from Evenballance to do this just post the license information. It would settle this once and for all.


eversonj90 said:
The choice of whether or not a server streams to PBBans is one that the server admin takes. No you wouldn't be able to filter on the server list which servers streaming to PBBans and which don't. At most you'd be able to filter which servers are PunkBuster enabled and which are not.

By accepting the PunkBuster EULA you agree to the following:
Licensee understands that PunkBuster software inspects and reports information about the computer on which it is installed to other connected computers and Licensee agrees to allow PunkBuster software to inspect and report such information about the computer on which Licensee installs PunkBuster software. Licensee understands and agrees that the information that may be inspected and reported by PunkBuster software includes, but is not limited to, Licensee's Internet Protocol Address, devices and any files residing on the hard-drive and in the memory of the computer on which PunkBuster software is installed. Licensee acknowledges and agrees that if Licensee does not want Licensor to collect and process such information, Licensee should not use the PunkBuster software.
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Thus when you connect to a PB enabled server you agree that if the server is utilizing PBUCON (actively streaming) - your information maybe transferred to another location (i.e. PBBans), in addition to the standard EvenBalance (PunkBuster).

We only ban on conclusive evidence, not inconclusive, and I'm more than happy to discuss any PBBans policies or any of the bans listed on our MBi and the evidence supporting the validity of said ban(s).
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#297
PBBANS collect no information from the users PC. Punkbuster does all the collecting and monitoring of PC.

PBBANS interacts with the punkbuster software on the gameserver to retrieve and update bans on the server. At no point in this process do they get access to or information from the users computer.

The optional MD5 checks that PBBANS maintain are stored on the server by an admin and executed by the punkbuster software on the client. This is only done at the request of the server side punkbuster software. Again at no point do PBBANS have any access to the users computer or any information that punkbuster has collected..

Disclaimer: This is only my understanding of how it works so the details may not be 100% correct.

A PBBANS admin would be better able to explain it or at least link to the relevant documentation.
 
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#300
REZ said:
This is too invasive for me. I don't want to open a backdoor into my computer to two different groups of people who I don't know, who are constantly monitoring, recording, storing and doing god knows what with my private information.. just cause there's a few cheaters out there. It's overkill in my opinion, and I would be very upset if I just paid 40 bucks for a product I wont fully be able to use unless I allow a bunch of unnamed people to have full system level access to my private files.
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Not trying to gang up on you, but I have a few concerns about your concerns.

You are Ok with VAC and Steam being connected but you have issue with PB which has been around just as long and is just as respected in the gaming community.

PunkBuster has been around long enough and researched by users to see what is and what is not sent to the servers. If there were an issue of private information being sent out, then it would be common knowledge and no respectable gaming company would pay for PB.



Your concerns are really overblown is basically what the situation looks like from the outside.
 
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