Petition to restore Realism and Authenticity

[Victhor-ASH]

Why not keep it all simple, the most balance mod there is now is Classic. It doesn't have all the fancy upgrades people still enjoy playing it because it makes up for proper gameplay. And you need to use a bit of skill to score a shot at distance because you don't have the zoom in.

In my opinion classic is the way to go although it isn't the most popular now. With some polish, weapons and bug fixing it would out the best of it. Also is one of the only mods where people make constant use of the riflemen class without complaining. Although many people scavange better weapons from the ground to score kills, the weapon picking system should be made more like Ostfront. Where you needed to pick also the ammunition from the downed soldier. Is too easy to pick up weapons in this game. I saw players having ten grenades in theyr use just picking them from dead soldiers and spamming.

Can't this game have a limitator so that not every riflemen, can pick up a smg/Machinegun or sniper. And limit the amount of grenades you can pick to the ones you already have. Also for weapons which aren't desired for the specific class why not add some kind of mutator to give the weapon insane recoil so that you won't go rambo style by picking a machinegun or sniper if you aren't the desired class. Maybe I'm but didn't Darkest Hour have such a feature?
Here's a video to prove my point a bit overexagerated 71: Into the Fire (2010) killcount - YouTube

[PhoenixDragon]

Originally Posted by Victhor-ASH

Also is one of the only mods where people make constant use of the riflemen class without complaining.

What? I haven't seen people complaining about riflemen in Realism mode, either. Also, I find the phrase "one of the only mods (sic)" to be amusing when we only have three modes. All three could be a certain way, and still be "one of the only" modes.

the weapon picking system should be made more like Ostfront.

You mean horribly clumsy? The Ostfront system made it way too hard to pick up something, as even if you were standing right on it, it often didn't work. It also resulted in absurd things, like how when someone shot the gun out of your hand, they also shot all your ammo pouches off you, too.

A system where you have to pick up individual ammo pouches from a fallen enemy could be nice (Preferably by interacting with the body, instead of hunting down scattered pouches on the ground), but "like Ostfront" would not.

Can't this game have a limitator so that not every riflemen, can pick up a smg/Machinegun or sniper.

It could... but that would be stupid. Also, unnecessary.

And limit the amount of grenades you can pick to the ones you already have.

We've seen plenty of pictures of soldiers carrying a half-dozen or more grenades in Stalingrad. Having the weight have more effect would be good, limiting you to never pick up more grenades than you start with would not.

Also for weapons which aren't desired for the specific class why not add some kind of mutator to give the weapon insane recoil so that you won't go rambo style by picking a machinegun or sniper if you aren't the desired class.

...So, you want to make it so that you can't pick up weapons of a different class, and if you do, they handle worse. I don't think you entirely thought your own ideas through.

Also, that would be pretty silly. Weapons don't gain more recoil because you were issued a different weapon before. It's not like they get jealous and decide to punish your shoulder because you chose some other weapon before them.

[Victhor-ASH]

...So, you want to make it so that you can't pick up weapons of a different class, and if you do, they handle worse. I don't think you entirely thought your own ideas through.

Also, that would be pretty silly. Weapons don't gain more recoil because you were issued a different weapon before. It's not like they get jealous and decide to punish your shoulder because you chose some other weapon before them

.

No but you aren't trained to handle a smg, or a machinegun, or sniper in the mather of case you should have some disadvantages when using them. A riflemen only trained with his rifle I don't think it would be an instant smg/machineguner/sniper. An untrained soldier with a specific weapon should have a harder time keeping and firing a specific weapon because it wasn't trained to use it that's my point.

Just think how stupid sounds in real life scenario a sniper that trained as a marksman for years, to have its sniper by a rookie riflemen and turning yourself into a vasily zaytsev calibre type of soldier to kill the enemy without a sweat. My point is that having a different class should deffinetly affect how the weapon handles in battle. I don't think that is so realistic if you pick up a heavy mg from the ground without even using it before in your life you will instantly become an expert. Some penalty should be applied.

We've seen plenty of pictures of soldiers carrying a half-dozen or more grenades in Stalingrad. Having the weight have more effect would be good, limiting you to never pick up more grenades than you start with would not.

Or grenades in this case, it's not a problem of weight but picking them is just too darn easy, you just sit on a dead corpse and pick the grenades, if you are lucky enough you can even pick 10 grenades. What would stop you to spam them by randomly throwing in any hole and building you see?.But the ammunition picking is ridiculous I found myself carrying sometimes 40 stripper clips of ammunition, there's no limit of how many you can pick from the ground and use. Incomparisson to Ostfront is too easy to pick them up. There you had to do a little bit of work the clumbsynes contributed to the fact that not all soldiers were lucky enough to get the enemies weapon.

I played a match once and got very annoyed when a hero just spawned and dropped his MKB, he did this like 10 times and all our team members had MKB's. Where's the realism in here, seeing all your team rolling on MKb's ? Why shouldn't a mutator be applied to limit the usage of the weapon, like using it only until the owner dies a few rounds then dissapearing from the class loadout. What is wrong with this? Same for the other weapons, but especially for the grenades and ammo which can be endlesly resuplied from death corpses.

[AtheistIII]

Just think how stupid sounds in real life scenario a sniper that trained as a marksman for years, to have its sniper by a rookie riflemen and turning yourself into a vasily zaytsev calibre type of soldier to kill the enemy without a sweat. My point is that having a different class should deffinetly affect how the weapon handles in battle. I don't think that is so realistic if you pick up a heavy mg from the ground without even using it before in your life you will instantly become an expert. Some penalty should be applied.

German infantry soldiers were all trained with the MG as a part of their standard training (don't know about the russians in that case), both the PPSch and the MP40 are very easy to handle afaik and a sniper rifle is a standard rifle with a scope on it, just usually a bit more accurate than the things without scopes, they shouldn't handle much different.
So I see no real reason to put such penalties on any of this weapons.

What would stop you to spam them by randomly throwing in any hole and building you see?

That was the way the rat war was fought.
Suspect an enemy behind a window?
Throw a grenade in.
Want to enter an unsecured room?
Secure with a F1.
Got an enemy in an entrenched position?
See how he feels if he has to share that position with an armed stick grenade.
Grenades were the weapons of Stalingrad.

I played a match once and got very annoyed when a hero just spawned and dropped his MKB, he did this like 10 times and all our team members had MKB's

If he really did this 10 times that would mean that 11 soldiers went into battle with a 200sec delay, which should give the opposing team enough time to either steamroll whatever your team has left on the front or dig in deep enough to mow down all of this eleven guys in no time.

[PhoenixDragon]

Originally Posted by Victhor-ASH

No but you aren't trained to handle a smg, or a machinegun, or sniper in the mather of case you should have some disadvantages when using them.

It's very common for infantry to be cross-trained in all weapons; typically the difference between a soldier with a MP40 and a soldier with a Kar98 is only that, when they deployed, one was issued the MP40 instead of a Kar98. That's pretty much it. There shouldn't be any appreciable penalty for using a different weapon in most cases.

More notably, it's kind of absurd to argue that there should be both a penalty to use weapons from outside your class, and make it impossible to pick up weapons from outside your class. You do realize that's somewhat redundant?

Why shouldn't a mutator be applied to limit the usage of the weapon, like using it only until the owner dies a few rounds then dissapearing from the class loadout. What is wrong with this? Same for the other weapons, but especially for the grenades and ammo which can be endlesly resuplied from death corpses.

Some form of logistics system would be good. Simply saying "you can't pick this up because it's the wrong class" or "this weapon handles differently because someone else had it first" is not.

If you really want a mutator to do something, go ahead and write one...

[bobsynergy]

Originally Posted by utek

wasn't this Tripwires job,to make a "real" RED ORCHESTRA game and not some...hmmm...well...RO2...

Dont get me wrong,i really love the game,but i can enjoy just a small % of it,and this is CLASSIC mode,its the only thig that comes close to this red orchestra feeling

this so called "realism" mode is just like super hardcore Call of Duty mode.
its super fast split second aim down sights no weapon sway spawn on squad leaders *** run n gun gamemode with ridiculously rare and unrealistic unlocks.

and the "kindergarten" mode i have no words for this ****.

+the singleplayer is meh...why even make a SP in a multiplayer focused game.
they should only make a singleplayer boot camp for basic training,class and weapon training like america's army.
+practice mode with bots.

And this is why nothing will ever be made, it's just a repeating circle.

Realism guys ask Tripwire to make RO more realistic, then people/TW tell them to make a mod and make it more realistic them selves and see where it goes, then people with that knowledge of how to map and code and mod/want it say that they won't waste their time doing so because it's Red Orchestra and it's already supposed to be realistic/authentic out of the box for the game they spent money on so why should they spend hundreds of hours doing things they believe Tripwire should of already done.

Rinse and Repeat so yeah I'm going to have to agree with Nezzer here.

[katzcinsky]

i wasn't going to but i'm gonna throw in my $0.02 here, i've been thinking about it ALOT since i picked up RO2 again last month.

i think i agree with alot of people here that that separate game modes really distract the community. RO1 was ONE kind of game, people didn't have a choice to how they wanted to play it.. everyone had to play by the same rules. it was a tough game, but that's what we all came to know it by.

i kinda wish RO2 was just one game mode. TWI should have a firmer stance as to what kindof game they want to make. Realism was the single, most important aspect of RO1, why is it not in RO2 ?

[utek]

Originally Posted by katzcinsky

i kinda wish RO2 was just one game mode. TWI should have a firmer stance as to what kindof game they want to make. Realism was the single, most important aspect of RO1, why is it not in RO2 ?

i think it was money...

the same thing happened to DICE and Battlefield 3,yea they got a new target audience and more money...but for what price?!?

they really pissed off the BF veterans-MordorHQ(http://www.mordorhq.com/forum.php) with this crap console port,run n gun,wannabe BF game...aha "a true sequel to Battlefield 2" my ***.
yea BF3 is a good FPS game,but a BAD Battlefield game.

and as for RO2 i got 5 or 6 copies of it,for me and my friends so i spent cca. 100 euros on it.
But if RO2 would be a "REAL" Red Orchestra game,i would give Tripwire 500 euros or more
why,you may ask?
its simle...its the only one,the only game,among milions other fps games,that is(was ) different...but you changed Tripwire...just like DICE.

[CocaineInMyBrain]

Originally Posted by utek

i think it was money...

the same thing happened to DICE and Battlefield 3,yea they got a new target audience and more money...but for what price?!?

they really pissed off the BF veterans-MordorHQ(http://www.mordorhq.com/forum.php) with this crap console port,run n gun,wannabe BF game...aha "a true sequel to Battlefield 2" my ***.
yea BF3 is a good FPS game,but a BAD Battlefield game.

and as for RO2 i got 5 or 6 copies of it,for me and my friends so i spent cca. 100 euros on it.
But if RO2 would be a "REAL" Red Orchestra game,i would give Tripwire 500 euros or more
why,you may ask?
its simle...its the only one,the only game,among milions other fps games,that is(was ) different...but you changed Tripwire...just like DICE.

To be fair people should of seen what became BF3 from a mile away, considering what BF:BC and BC2 looked like.

[utek]

Originally Posted by CocaineInMyBrain

To be fair people should of seen what became BF3 from a mile away, considering what BF:BC and BC2 looked like.

nope
bad company 1 and 2 are spinoffs,so they are not real battlefield games.
but BF3 was hiden behind lies and promises...
"true sequel to battlefield 2"
"a good year for a battlefield player"
"Have some bloody Faith will you?! "
"nailed it"

if you have some time read this http://www.mordorhq.com/showthread.p...ty-amp-EA-DICE

[BuenaventuraDurruti]

I think what most people want is a game that is way more realistic than most fps titles (CoD, BF, et al), but not going so far as to be Project Reality 1943. All the game modes fall in that category to some extent, it is just the degree on the spectrum that people want. I'd like to see a more realistic game mode, but I would like it to be one that adds elements as well as taking unrealistic elements away (Classic doesnt have any extra elements, it just subtracts). For instance, if I shoot a guy in the leg, but he survives, he should walk with a limp at least for the rest of the match. If I am switching weapons, I should take a second to put the one I have out currently away. If I stick a guy with a bayonet (except for instant kill regions), he should scream, and the Bayonet should have the possibility of being stuck for a few seconds (they werent designed to be used for ninja-clearing a room by yourself). Grenades should take longer to go off, but also be more devastating in close quarters. Artillery should have an effect on your hearing that lasts longer than the regular suppression.

Essentially, the whole point of a realistic mode would be to not just take away fantasy elements, but also introduce new elements (that list was just an example of possibilities off the top of my head) that make cooperation and forethought indispensable elements of the game.