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OGGs don't download from servers

Having the default map music dl from servers would also mean making the music a merged package like the rest of the content type (if you modify the package you will get a version mismatch error online).
The implications of having the wrong version of music playing for a given map are far from game breaking!

Even though it would be the ideal solution, the proposition is NOT to allow OGGs to be embedded within Unreal packages (and therefore downloadable) as this would necessitate repackaging a load of old maps as you rightly imply.

Rather the OGG files should be downloaded by the game directly - simplified example implementation:
1. Walk the map for references to OGG files, check they all exist on disk / in cache, if not download.
2. For versioning issues: compare the sizes + mod times / MD5 checksums of files that already existed in local cache with those on the server, if they differ purge the one in cache and download again.
 
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So you're proposing the removal of the ability for clients to replace the music with that of their own?

Comformed (not merge, confused terms) pacakges are simply packages which must be the same on the server and client. For a server to push a file it has to be told that a file is required for the current game and the client doesn't have it. If the client has a different version of the same file the server will refuse the connection. In addition to the actual music, map INTs and INIs both hold playlist information. Since they are pertinent to determining what music should play when they would need to be conformed as well. For an INI, this is never going to happen. Map INTs also present a huge problem because of the differences due to localization.

There are a few heavy repercussions for making music a mandatory package type. The more you look into it the more things come up that will be effected, a lot of which is taken for granted.
 
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So you're proposing the removal of the ability for clients to replace the music with that of their own?
No.

But those actually doing this will be in an extremely small minority so if this ability had to be removed it would hardly be tragic. If players want their own music in game they should mute the game's music volume and run iTunes in the background.

Really this thread should be about whether having music automagically downloading is a good idea generally and the responses so far seem to indicate a strong Yes.

Rather than the technical details/issues of making it happen which I am sure the Tripwire devs are more than competent enough to address for themselves when it comes to being implemented, INT files and all!
 
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Sometimes the music can force me to disconnect. Like if the map plays rap music on the background, I could not play it for long before I either have to turn it off or disconnect. :p

We can't always trust the musical taste of the mapper to match our own, so... Play your own music! ;)

I ditched iTunes years ago. :rolleyes:

Foobar2000 is a fast, light music player that can run on the background quite comfortably. It has a small memory usage and has support for multiple playlists and additionally some other goodies as plugins. Sure, it doesn't look as great but I use it to listen to music, not watch the player window. ;)
 
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"iTunes" in my previous post being a placeholder for your particular media player of choice. Let's not go off on that tangent :rolleyes:

If someone did a map inspired by the new 50 Cent game (god help us) rap music _would_ be the natural choice!

A map's music should be just an intrinsic component of the map as its textures, especially when dynamic music is used (for the best example of this again see the story maps).

If it has horrible music you could simply choose not to play it, just as when the map has horrible textures. I don't quibble with a Director's choice of music in his film and the same applies to mappers and their maps: bad music = bad film = bad map

For example I find the music on the standard KF maps greatly enhances the experience even though I would not choose to listen to that genre ordinarily myself.
 
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* bump *

And some other TWI input would be greatly appreciated!
ftfy ;)

Forcing music will increase download times, drastically with maps like Hive. Server redirect hosts were more/less being DOS'd during the free weekend from the sheer volume of tranfers just from existing conformed packages alone. Adding more will only increase loads in times like these, effectively preventing any content from being pushed at all. This would also remove the ability for music to be changed cilentside (no custom soundtracks per player).
I'm giving you options here but I've yet to see a compelling argument for music pushing other than the "it would be cool". I'd like to see it done and it may be out there but I've yet to see the advantage come up that makes all the drawback worth it.
 
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Forcing music will increase download times
No more than the maps themselves already require. In fact, as already mentioned, the oggs take up far, far less than the maps.

drastically with maps like Hive
The Hive is pretty much the only level in existence that possesses a total ogg size rivaling that of the map, but nobody plays The Hive anyway so it's a moot point.

Server redirect hosts were more/less being DOS'd during the free weekend from the sheer volume of tranfers just from existing conformed packages alone.
But the free weekend is over now. Servers better be able to handle some tiny ogg file transfers considering they're a mere fraction of the actual map file sizes they should be capable of transferring.

This would also remove the ability for music to be changed cilentside (no custom soundtracks per player).
And how is this any different from every other element of the game being completely unchangeable as well? If people really want a custom soundtrack for KF, they can mute the in-game music and play their own tracks. Me? I want to hear the music that the map authors have seen fit to include as part of their creation.

but I've yet to see the advantage come up that makes all the drawback worth it.
Players would actually be able to hear the custom music that authors have implemented into their maps as opposed to dead silence.
 
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An obvious solution to that would to make an AllowOGGDownload INI option etc so it can be disabled if it absolutely must have to be.

OGG download has been similarly bolted on to other UE2.5 games and far from the sky falling on their heads has actually enabled their modders to create music for the mainstream player audience.

Maps like The Hive where the creators have pulled out all the stops music-wise should be in the majority not the novel minority.

If you asked a random selection of normal players (after explaining what an OGG is and what this feature would mean!) the vast majority would be in favour and many would be surprised that KF doesn't do this already ... please make it happen!
 
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pm the devs

pm the devs

If you asked a random selection of normal players (after explaining what an OGG is and what this feature would mean!) the vast majority would be in favour and many would be surprised that KF doesn't do this already ... please make it happen!

Don't just bump the thread and make pleas to the universe, pm the devs namely:

[TW]Wilsonam
[TW]schneidzekk
[TW]Xienen

Check the read confirmation box to see if/when they read your email.
---
 
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I'm sure they get enough to their personal inboxes as it is and it would be courteous of you to stop spamming them if that's what you do.

A post here is communication with Tripwire in their own venue that they created entirely for it and I trust they will get round to reading this discussion in due course. The bump was to ensure the thread wasn't cleaned up since it's been 2 months.

Judging by your post history, robdude19, your preferred use of their forum as a social venue is actually what is secondary to its purpose and essentially "offtopic". So you've quite a nerve rebuking me.
 
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Wow, I didn't know that music was never sent to players downloading maps from the server. Sort of makes me wonder why I wasted my time uploading OGGs for some of the maps on my server in the first place...

So now I know players aren't getting the full experience if they just plug in and play - which the majority do, no sense dancing around the point - is it really worth keeping custom music (and the maps it applies to) on there? I'm leaning towards no.

I suppose if you really wanted to preserve the original map experiences as the author intended, you could prevent all server downloads and force players to download maps manually before playing. Problem is, that vast majority will most likely just look for somewhere else to play rather than go through the effort of hunting down a map they've never seen before.
 
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Make the music download with the map, please. It's annoying to download a good map automatically that you wish to try...then to find that if you want the MUSIC for the map, you have to go out and manually download it. That sucks. It's inefficient, and except for possible legal reasons on copyrighted music, I don't see any reason for it. If they aren't policing maps for "Illegal" textures from other games, they shouldn't do it for music either.

I don't know why it wasn't implimented in the first place, really. I remember downloading Doom 2 online, THEN hearing that it has music for it, but only if you download and install manually. The map isn't the same without the music. A lot of maps are this way. I'd rather have to manually delete bad music (There are a few maps with "Very heavy" metal that I don't particularly like), than have to manually download good music!
 
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