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Blood Vial

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#81
I thought a little bit and came with conclusion, that replacing Medic's hand grenades with blood vials in the same way as it is for Firebug with firenades sounds fine, easy to implement, and will add some new tactics to the game. As it is now, in the good team (mostly - friends only) game there is just no place for mecic (I don't want to comment this again, search the forum for explanation). Adding blood nading ability could bring back Medic perk to the pro-team games.
 
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#82
poosh said:
I thought a little bit and came with conclusion, that replacing Medic's hand grenades with blood vials in the same way as it is for Firebug with firenades sounds fine, easy to implement, and will add some new tactics to the game. As it is now, in the good team (mostly - friends only) game there is just no place for mecic (I don't want to comment this again, search the forum for explanation). Adding blood nading ability could bring back Medic perk to the pro-team games.
Click to expand...

There's one major problem with that though. The grenade doesn't have a 5 second fuse time on it. So we couldn't really alter the duration of the diversion. Also, its likely to explode before having any effect.

It just two totally different game mechanics working against each other. Blowing up before even able to attract?
 
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#83
Benjamin said:
It's an interesting idea, but you have to then ask yourself why the specimens are following the players instead of just gathering around the pools of blood that have been accumulated from injured players.

I think something that creates a 'fear spot' like a regular grenade does would be more fitting since the mechanic already exists:

YouTube - ‪Killing Floor - Fear‬‏

It'd give the medic a few seconds to heal the injured player and allow them to try to get out of the situation.
Click to expand...

You hold a good point, it does seem a little flawed in that sense but I'm sure you can find a few flaws in the game already. Like why does the FB's nades just transform in to a whirlwind of fire?

Still, I'm sure I could create a bit of a backstory for the blood vial, it could possibly have been enriched with some other solution making it more attractive? Though I wouldn't know what solution. :)
 
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#84
Sick Jargon said:
There's one major problem with that though. The grenade doesn't have a 5 second fuse time on it. So we couldn't really alter the duration of the diversion. Also, its likely to explode before having any effect.

It just two totally different game mechanics working against each other. Blowing up before even able to attract?
Click to expand...

You didn't understand me. It shouldn't be like pipebomb in L4D: attract enemies, then detonate. Blood vial should do only the first part: attract zeds. Killing part should be left for other perks.
 
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#85
poosh said:
You didn't understand me. It shouldn't be like pipebomb in L4D: attract enemies, then detonate. Blood vial should do only the first part: attract zeds. Killing part should be left for other perks.
Click to expand...

Ah, sorry, I get what you mean..

Well, it was previously mentioned that the vials should replace the grenades. However, it seems more people prefer it being provided as a tool for all perks rather than just the medic but... The Blood Vial will still go in favor of the Medic as they will get better discounts and carry more of them.


Oh and just to add, my original post has been altered again if some of you wish to keep updated :)
 
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#89
Azukki said:
Between demo, firebug, support, and commando, I think the mobs already have it hard enough.

It's a novel idea, but without some major added challenges to counteract it, I don't think it would be a good addition to the game.
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Disagree.

Playing Hoe, usually ppl don use Medics becuase it litterly miss alot of fire power. and getting 1 shot by fps. its not much use for what its purpose is either. giving it this ability just might change that. :)

but I can Agree that this ability might be overpowered for Normal and beginner difficuly uses. but those are not supose to be hard to begin with so the losses are minimal:)
 
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#90
It's the difficulty above suicidal. HoE is supposed to not be easily approachable by anything less than a coordinated team of skilled level 6s. The players should feel underpowered, there.
If you give the players a bunch of benefits, without adding in detriments, HoE will be softened, and will fail to provide the best players with a challenge, and once again, a new, harder difficulty would be needed.

I'm not saying you shouldn't adjust the balance between perks, but if you give such a major benefit to a perk, it benefits the players in general, and if you don't give the zeds some advantages, the balance will be unstable, and you'll have to keep shifting the fulcrum, instead of maintaining a challenging balance in the first place.

When someone plays a difficulty too easy for them, everything should be overpowered, so that's kind of a moot point.
 
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#91
Blockbot said:
Disagree.

Playing Hoe, usually ppl don use Medics becuase it litterly miss alot of fire power. and getting 1 shot by fps. its not much use for what its purpose is either. giving it this ability just might change that. :)

but I can Agree that this ability might be overpowered for Normal and beginner difficuly uses. but those are not supose to be hard to begin with so the losses are minimal:)
Click to expand...

A 5:1 ratio of Berserker and Medic is actually very good on HoE.

While the Berserkers are focused on doing the killing in melee and taking down all the main threats, the Medic can use an Xbow to take down the Sirens and Husks that would be an annoyance to the Berserkers.

While Medic lacks the survivability of Berserker (in terms of after armour or Sirens) they can make up for it by keeping everyone healed well so that the Berserkers don't have to stop killing to heal themselves. If it's a Berserker and Medic left alive, the Medic can heal the Berserker without a speed loss and when you're kiting Fleshpounds, this is big.


While it is possible to play HoE without Medic, that's usually only camping, when you stack Support or just focus fire down a hallway. They don't need the Medic because they kill everything too quickly.
But one bad move can turn an otherwise successful game into an (almost) instant wipe.

Though, with pub games, Medic is always a sound choice to have on the team.
In premade/friends games you can circumvent this with enhanced teamwork skills.

I'll just say to end this tirade/rambling/rant/tangent;

Having a Medic is usually a good choice, because you never know when you'll need one.
 
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#92
Azukki said:
It's the difficulty above suicidal. HoE is supposed to not be easily approachable by anything less than a coordinated team of skilled level 6s. The players should feel underpowered, there.
If you give the players a bunch of benefits, without adding in detriments, HoE will be softened, and will fail to provide the best players with a challenge, and once again, a new, harder difficulty would be needed.

I'm not saying you shouldn't adjust the balance between perks, but if you give such a major benefit to a perk, it benefits the players in general, and if you don't give the zeds some advantages, the balance will be unstable, and you'll have to keep shifting the fulcrum, instead of maintaining a challenging balance in the first place.

When someone plays a difficulty too easy for them, everything should be overpowered, so that's kind of a moot point.
Click to expand...

Yeh, I have to agree. Your point is valid enough to have this thread totally ignored so my guess is, this wont get implemented. Though initially I was quite content with the idea but you never really know all the implications until others have put their thoughts forward.

Still, I'm glad many attempted to think of ways to balance this idea as well as back it.
 
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#93
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#94
Lunatic[BoM] said:
Not a bad idea at all.
Here is my try at modelling it:

http://i53.tinypic.com/2ebuwkg.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/jqrmgm.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/2v8pj7l.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/nnr8ch.jpg

I know it doesn't look very good, i didn't have time to play with rendering and the light, also the model is very basic. But what do you think?
Click to expand...

Wow, I wasn't expecting that. I like it! It's a lot better than I could ever do anyway lol. Thanks for sharing! :)

+1 for the effort :D
 
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#96
How long does it attract them?
All those restrictions, weaknesses, special conditions and the price of 180 per shot of which you can only carry up to 3 is kind of over the top if it only lasts 3 or 5 seconds and that's all you need for a quick reaction "get out of jailrape" card for a surrounded teammate.
A grenadelauncher gets that job done too (on non-friendly fire servers) for less dosh per shot of which you can have many more and has some utility beyond that.
I didn't read all posts but my wild guess is that everyone speculates how "OP" this would be without even pondering over that tiny detail.

Only restriction this should have is that it doesn't affect raging specimens so you can't use this to make pounds and scrakes run away at high speed but if it really is 180 per shot with a limit of 3, then even that should probably be possible.
Sounds like a fun thing to block by linedancers.
 
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#97
9_6 said:
How long does it attract them?
All those restrictions, weaknesses, special conditions and the price of 180 per shot of which you can only carry up to 3 is kind of over the top if it only lasts 3 or 5 seconds and that's all you need for a quick reaction "get out of jailrape" card for a surrounded teammate.
A grenadelauncher gets that job done too (on non-friendly fire servers) for less dosh per shot of which you can have many more and has some utility beyond that.
I didn't read all posts but my wild guess is that everyone speculates how "OP" this would be without even pondering over that tiny detail.

Only restriction this should have is that it doesn't affect raging specimens so you can't use this to make pounds and scrakes run away at high speed but if it really is 180 per shot with a limit of 3, then even that should probably be possible.
Sounds like a fun thing to block by linedancers.
Click to expand...

lol confusing...

still think swap vials for nades
Effect 5sec
Scrake fp = imune.

Easier cant it be :)
 
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#99
Azukki said:
It's the difficulty above suicidal. HoE is supposed to not be easily approachable by anything less than a coordinated team of skilled level 6s. The players should feel underpowered, there.
If you give the players a bunch of benefits, without adding in detriments, HoE will be softened, and will fail to provide the best players with a challenge, and once again, a new, harder difficulty would be needed.

I'm not saying you shouldn't adjust the balance between perks, but if you give such a major benefit to a perk, it benefits the players in general, and if you don't give the zeds some advantages, the balance will be unstable, and you'll have to keep shifting the fulcrum, instead of maintaining a challenging balance in the first place.

When someone plays a difficulty too easy for them, everything should be overpowered, so that's kind of a moot point.
Click to expand...

+1

Totally agree.

The idea sounds nice in concept, but i really doubt it can be implemented in game.
 
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