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Science Ponders Zombie Attack

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Science ponders 'zombie attack'


By Pallab Ghosh
Science correspondent, BBC News
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If zombies actually existed, an attack by them would lead to the collapse of civilisation unless dealt with quickly and aggressively.
That is the conclusion of a mathematical exercise carried out by researchers in Canada.
They say only frequent counter-attacks with increasing force would eradicate the fictional creatures.
The scientific paper is published in a book - Infectious Diseases Modelling Research Progress.
In books, films, video games and folklore, zombies are undead creatures, able to turn the living into other zombies with a bite.
But there is a serious side to the work.
In some respects, a zombie "plague" resembles a lethal rapidly-spreading infection.
In their study, the researchers from the University of Ottawa and Carleton University (also in Ottawa) posed a question: If there was to be a battle between zombies and the living, who would win?
Professor Robert Smith? (the question mark is part of his surname and not a typographical mistake) and colleagues wrote: "We model a zombie attack using biological assumptions based on popular zombie movies.
"We introduce a basic model for zombie infection and illustrate the outcome with numerical solutions."
On his university web page, the mathematics professor at Ottawa University says the question mark distinguishes him from Robert Smith, lead singer of rock band The Cure.
To give the living a fighting chance, the researchers chose "classic" slow-moving zombies as our opponents rather than the nimble, intelligent creatures portrayed in some recent films.
"While we are trying to be as broad as possible in modelling zombies - especially as there are many variables - we have decided not to consider these individuals," the researchers said.
Back for good?
Even so, their analysis revealed that a strategy of capturing or curing the zombies would only put off the inevitable.
In their scientific paper, the authors conclude that humanity's only hope is to "hit them [the undead] hard and hit them often".
They added: "It's imperative that zombies are dealt with quickly or else... we are all in a great deal of trouble."
According to the researchers, the key difference between the zombies and the spread of real infections is that "zombies can come back to life".
But they say that their work has parallels with, for example, the spread of ideas.
The study has been welcomed by one of the world's leading disease specialists, Professor Neil Ferguson, who is one of the UK government's chief advisors on controlling the spread of swine flu.
"The paper considers something that many of us have worried about - particularly in our younger days - of what would be a feasible way of tackling an outbreak of a rapidly spreading zombie infection," said Professor Ferguson, from Imperial College London.
However he thinks that some of the assumptions made in the paper might be unduly alarmist.
"My understanding of zombie biology is that if you manage to decapitate a zombie then it's dead forever. So perhaps they are being a little over-pessimistic when they conclude that zombies might take over a city in three or four days," he said.



[url]http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8206280.stm[/URL]


The threat is real. Who said Killing Floor wasn't realism?
 
Figuratively speaking zombies exist; carriers of contagious disease. Just most common disease usually isn't life threatening. Luckily there haven't been many Typhoid Marys. If there existed some kind of necrotizing disease that also attacked the prefrontal cortex and was transmitted through blood or saliva then I think we'd have a real zombie apocalypse on our hands. ;)
 
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The premise is ridiculous, IMO. The zombie transmission method is insanely inefficient. The average human being is more than a match for the average zed, the latter being clutzy and slow as ****, so much so that they're easily dispatched with anything heavy and blunt. The early infection stages wouldn't get far since zombies require the strength of a Horde to do anything. Unfortunately, as a Catch 22, they need to do something to get the Horde. While they can run numbers all they want, scientists kinda fail to take into account that people fight back.

But even assuming that, there's no doubt that the military would hit them hard, fast, and without mercy. I cannot see world class military fighting forces who constantly battle other highly intelligent and capable human beings falling to hordes or brainless morons who's sole advantage is "I only die if you hit me in the face." Hell, third world militias could probably kill zombies dead. Those guys have experience, if nothing else.

That all said, it has little to do with KF. The Specimens are clones, not the undead residents of the UK. They're actually fairly intelligent, come in a variety of shapes and sizes, and have a madman with a chaingun and rocket launcher arm leading them. Hell, the Fleshpound could probably rip up tanks.
 
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clearly some1 hasn't read World War Z the military is always ready for the last war they fought for example when we (Americans) went into Iraq and Afghanistan we were ready to face a standing soviet army not hit and run guerrilla tactics. Even if there only advantage is to hit them in the face most soldiers are trained to aim for the center mass which is ineffective to Ghouls i don't want to continue with this just listen to the it is an excerpt for World War Z that covers the battle of Yonkers NY and what happens when the American military goes up against the undead with cold war tactics.
Part 1 YouTube - World War Z: The Battle of Yonkers (1/3)
Part 2 YouTube - World War Z: The Battle of Yonkers (2/3)
Part 3 YouTube - World War Z: The Battle of Yonkers (3/3)
 
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The premise is ridiculous, IMO. The zombie transmission method is insanely inefficient. The average human being is more than a match for the average zed, the latter being clutzy and slow as ****, so much so that they're easily dispatched with anything heavy and blunt. The early infection stages wouldn't get far since zombies require the strength of a Horde to do anything. Unfortunately, as a Catch 22, they need to do something to get the Horde. While they can run numbers all they want, scientists kinda fail to take into account that people fight back.

But even assuming that, there's no doubt that the military would hit them hard, fast, and without mercy. I cannot see world class military fighting forces who constantly battle other highly intelligent and capable human beings falling to hordes or brainless morons who's sole advantage is "I only die if you hit me in the face." Hell, third world militias could probably kill zombies dead. Those guys have experience, if nothing else.

That all said, it has little to do with KF. The Specimens are clones, not the undead residents of the UK. They're actually fairly intelligent, come in a variety of shapes and sizes, and have a madman with a chaingun and rocket launcher arm leading them. Hell, the Fleshpound could probably rip up tanks.

A fleshpound could maybe tear up a lightly armored vehicle, like a land rover or humvee. But you are seriously under estimating tanks if you think it can simply be smashed to bits by something that actually takes more than one strike to kill a human being.

Most modern tanks have depleted uranium, the densest synthetic and possibly known material integrated into their armor, or reactive* armor on some of the older models that have been updated.

A fleshpound smashing reactive armor would be hilarious imo, but the problem with zed's as a "zombie" threat, is that with or without live humans, they continue to multiply. Though I agree that any typical military or milita would be able to deal with zombie attacks with ease. The problem with every zombie film is classic SPS (Stupid people syndrome. When people do incredibly stupid things) and the fact it seems every character in the movie has never seen...a zombie movie.**

*(Reactive armor is a system in which a tank is covered in hundreds of shaped charges along it's form. When a projectile contacts a charge, the charge explodes outward, hopefully destroying the projectile with minimum damage to the tank. C-4 is generally used in reactive armor [so far as I know])

** I also hate it when a hardcore, badass military squad gets wiped out in thirty seconds, while some painter, or writer or plumber or whatever somehow eludes, escapes and destroys an entire army of the undead.
 
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Surely dense populated areas would be overun. A human's natural instinct would be flight at the onset of the infection risk. The army cannot nuke cities for fear of killing civilians so the cities eventually get overrun. The mutant/zombies multiply and the army only has sufficient resource to quaranteen cities/areas holding back the hordes. Islands like Great Britain would most likely have to be abandoned. God helps us if the infeection reached continental Europe and therefore the gateway to Asia and Africa making 3 continents uninhabitable.
 
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clearly some1 hasn't read World War Z the military is always ready for the last war they fought for example when we (Americans) went into Iraq and Afghanistan we were ready to face a standing soviet army not hit and run guerrilla tactics. Even if there only advantage is to hit them in the face most soldiers are trained to aim for the center mass which is ineffective to Ghouls i don't want to continue with this just listen to the it is an excerpt for World War Z that covers the battle of Yonkers NY and what happens when the American military goes up against the undead with cold war tactics.

1. I have read WWZ. And the zombie survival guide. Both showcase a lack of knowledge in firearms and how the military works.

2. When we went into Iraq and Afghanistan we weren't expected a "standing soviet army." The USSR collasped more than a decaded ago. Do you think the Army somehow missed that?

3. You don't need to hit them in the head dude. It's called a bomb. Hell, it's called gassing your tanks up and running the horde the **** over. Or getting in a Chopper with a mini-gun, queing up flight of the Valkyries and raining down lead-based hell. Or, hell a flamethrower. Pin point accuracy is not required. A destroyed body can be verified as utterly neutralized (head destroyed) after the battle.

4. Yonkers was a stupid Author Fiat where America lost because Brooks said so.

The notion of America not bringing enough boom to a fight is ludicrous. Of all the nations of the world, the USA is the one most known for it's tendancy for total crushing overkill.

We don't bring enough boom to kill the enemy. We bring enough boom to kill the enemy, his friends and anyone that might have ever once entertained the notion of being friends with that guy.

A fleshpound could maybe tear up a lightly armored vehicle, like a land rover or humvee. But you are seriously under estimating tanks if you think it can simply be smashed to bits by something that actually takes more than one strike to kill a human being.

Yeah, probably.

A fleshpound smashing reactive armor would be hilarious imo,
Haha, yes!

I also hate it when a hardcore, badass military squad gets wiped out in thirty seconds, while some painter, or writer or plumber or whatever somehow eludes, escapes and destroys an entire army of the undead.
Yeah, not my favorite aspect of hollywood. Camo is the new red shirt.
 
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Whilst the US military is indeed mighty and impressive they are not equipped for a mass invasion of Zombies her beautiful soil. Populated areas would go down quickly and the hordes would control these areas - you cannot bomb everywhere the Military would try and quarnateen. However as always the sheer weight of numbers of zombies would ultimately prevail - witness the WW2 Eastern front where Stalin just had more bodies to send to their death against the Nazis. The Western front, weather conditions and logistics ultimately doomed the Nazis but before these really took effect it was only the sheer weight of cannon fodder that Stalin had at his disposal that prevented the Nazis taking Moscow.
 
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those were people with feelings and stuff where a body shot would do Ghouls/Zeds/Zach/MR.Z only go down with a head shot hence the reason that both fully automatic weapons and flamethrowers don't work against Zach. And when i say a standing soviet army I don't mean where all going over Europe kill Ivan Ivanovich i mean an army that has similar organization tactics and discipline.
 
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If we're talking zombies, those are fairly easy to kill. Especially for a organized military. I personally loved how in shawn of the dead, the military was the end of the thing, considering that's pretty much how it would happen.

Most automatic rifles hold a 30 round magazine, with LMGS usually having a 200 round magazine, and america's favorite mounted 50.cal MG having the ability to turn a human being into so much gore and bloody paste with a direct hit to center mass, shear off limbs with a mere clip of the target, and rupture vital organs with a near miss (due to the vacuum).

A single solider with a 50 cal MG and a wide open space could kill as many zombies as he had ammunition, if not more (as the 50. rounds will easily penetrate a human body and continue to tear a path of red ruin).
Also, the military would not be so squeamish as you might think to destroy towns, or even a city if it meant saving the nation. All they do is run some clever cover up, and everyone is content with the explanation, and more importantly, alive.

As for zeds, things become more complicated due to their varied structure and abilities, not to mention their ability to procreate indefinitely, via spawning tanks.
Though their nature (being alive) makes them far more vulnerable to standard methods of destruction. It's likely biological or chemical warfare could be used to clear out entire swathes of specimens, leaving the area completely intact, considering flesh eating mutants aren't protected by the geneva convention.

The only problem, is how many spawn, how quick, and where.
 
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what Zombies are you talking about the ones here are like the ones in World War z the can only moan and saunter twards there target (the ones in l4d are more Hollywood with different special abilites and such) the only way to create more is the transfer of the virus that created them in the first place. Personally i think we are talking about totaly different types of zomibes. If the out break were small enough i.e. a class 2 something like Shawn it would be fairly easy to cover up however if it happens where the threat is not enitrly understood like a third world country it would be harder and harder to cover up as the refugees trying to escape the virus end up spreading it.
 
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...it's just near-impossible for an infection that starts with one person and is spread only through bites to spread enough to take over the entire world if the infected persons move so slowly and have no real thought processes.

The only reason it even happens in the movies is because, for some inexplicable reason, EVERYONE suddenly becomes a zombie. Look at Romero's Dawn of the Dead, even. Most of the zombies there are 100% unharmed. Not corpses who rose up from the ground. Not folks who randomly died. Not folks who got bitten. Just normal, unharmed folks who suddenly became zombies for no reason. Unless something ridiculous like that happened, a zombie outbreak wouldn't happen.

The government wouldn't be slow on the uptake with what's going on. They're not morons. If there was an outbreak somewhere, they'd capture a few for 'research', then promptly exterminate the rest. A few helicopters with miniguns flying around could pretty much shred the zombies from absolute safety, and something as simple as a deep trench would be enough to delay anything short of a MASS of zombies almost indefinitely...

I like World War Z and the Zombie Survival Guide as much as the next guy, but even I realize how unrealistic they are. The Battle of Yonkers stood out as particularly stupid. The military would've OBVIOUSLY had the sense to fall back. Humvees/trucks/helicopters can easily outrun a horde of zombies. And that's assuming that the soldiers there couldn't just duck inside of a tank/APC and be quite literally INVULNERABLE from the zombies. I'm kinda skeptical that the military would even send in troops and tanks when they could, as I said, just circle the area with choppers constantly, cutting the zombies down, or napalm-bomb the horde.

Barring something like Romero's 'Half the planet instantly dies and zombifies', some sort of airborn virus (In which case we're ALL pretty much screwed), or something with especially FAST and LETHAL zombies like 28-days later, the popular 'zombie apocalypse' won't happen, period.
 
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Barring something like Romero's 'Half the planet instantly dies and zombifies', some sort of airborn virus (In which case we're ALL pretty much screwed), or something with especially FAST and LETHAL zombies like 28-days later, the popular 'zombie apocalypse' won't happen, period.

Pretty much sum up every thing. I'd like to fully quote your post, but it's just too long, so...

Yes, that's all I'd say. If there are open space, a small group of well trained military will single hand (not literally) handle the horde, so long as there supply last. Thing of this scenario like a kf-defence-b2 map with 100 guys. Or the end of RE3.

And even in some underground tunnel/structure like in RE1, thing just as simple as sealing all the exit, and throw in some special bomb.It will suck all the air, let the zombie helpless. The lucky ones will be caught and throw to some sort of high security shady lab.

A .50 cal gun can cut a body in a half (as I've seen it done with a pig), and even a normal gun shot as mass body, it will cause heavy loss of blood, eventually kill the zombie, so the head shot could only instant kill them, while the other shot will slowly kill them. Not that slowly, mind you, considering they keep moving around. This is another utterly stupid about zombie. If I shot 1 bullet every inch sq on its body, but not the head, and the bullet stuck in the body, or penetrate thwu it, but not ricochet back, I doubt it could as much standing, let alone going toward me.

That being said, I'm pretty enjoy all the zombie-shooting game. The series RE has remarkably good plot.
 
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Whilst the US military is indeed mighty and impressive they are not equipped for a mass invasion of Zombies her beautiful soil.

Aside from the inability to die from anything sort of brain damage and inexhaustible morale (or lack thereof), a zombie attack is no different from a riot. Any nation worth it's salt is prepared to wide-scale rioting.

The zombies would get their **** wrecked in short order. Especially since they would not reach the "mass invasion" stage. They'd be slaughtered whilst horde-building.

[/quote] Populated areas would go down quickly and the hordes would control these areas - you cannot bomb everywhere the Military would try and quarnateen. However as always the sheer weight of numbers of zombies would ultimately prevail - witness the WW2 Eastern front where Stalin just had more bodies to send to their death against the Nazis. The Western front, weather conditions and logistics ultimately doomed the Nazis but before these really took effect it was only the sheer weight of cannon fodder that Stalin had at his disposal that prevented the Nazis taking Moscow.[/QUOTE]

Yes. Stalin's cannor fodder, however had guns and tanks and bombs.

This cannon fodder has fingers and teeth. This cannon fodder also can't think half as well as a Soviet soldier. A zombie can't sit in a building and blow your head off. He'll throw himself out the window to get at you, break every limb on the way down and lie there moaning helplessly.

those were people with feelings and stuff where a body shot would do Ghouls/Zeds/Zach/MR.Z only go down with a head shot hence the reason that both fully automatic weapons and flamethrowers don't work against Zach. And when i say a standing soviet army I don't mean where all going over Europe kill Ivan Ivanovich i mean an army that has similar organization tactics and discipline.

1. When going into Afghanistan we were still not expecting that. We were going for the Taliban. We were going for terrorists. We were not gunning for the Afghani government - the Afghanis hated the Taliban (and still do) as much as we do.

2. When we went in for Iraq we were expecting that. And we found that army. And we killed the **** out of it.

Did you even watch the news or what, man?
 
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I guess it depends if the zombies needed to feed, which biology tells us all living things need nutrients. If we assume they feed on living flesh then sooner or later their food sources would run out. All humans would need to do is set up camp in some heavily defended forts or run to some very low populated areas (Siberia, Scottish Highlands, Poles), the zombies are gonna have quite a trek. Then if we assume they start eating each other they would start decreasing in number, if they don't they just starve to death, so in conclusion they may kill 90% of the population but the human race would survive. :D
 
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I never considered Zombiecide. That's probably the answer. Unless the human race can be wiped out in 2 weeks the zombies would have to turn on themselves to survive.

I always wondered about that.

I can kind of understand your typical, shuffling, moaning, non-intelligent zombie going specifically for a beating heart with warm flesh and blood. But how would they distinguish that? And how would they stop from decomposing?

As for the 28weeks later version, why didn't they just set upon each other in an orgy of violence? I cringed multiple times in the second movie (in which I hoped the military would be portrayed well) and pointed out various problems of which would never have happened*, or would easily have been remedied.

And as most have said, unless, magically, the vast majority of the population is zombified for no apparent reason, and lots of stupid people provide them fresh fodder (the only way hollywood can seemingly make a zombie plot**) There's no way things would get out of hand
.

* For instance, in 28 weeks later, they would not have given a civilian an all access card. Especially when they found out they were holding his wife, whom of which was a carrier. Someone would have been guarding said carrier, at least two to four people. I have no idea how he stumbled out, killed two fully grown, combat trained, completely alert locked and loaded men within thirty seconds, in a wide open room the size of a parking garage.

They would not have simply used "Chains" to lock people in. They would have likely chosen a room higher up, as it is far more difficult to escape, and far further from the ground (they are not trying to "protect" them, they are trying to "isolate" them.). And worst of all, if people started pouring out of the doors [a perfect choke point] they would have opened up with everything [including at least two 50. cal MG's] and tore everything escaping to bloody shreds.

**At least "planet terror" didn't even attempt to take itself seriously, which made it all the more enjoyable.
 
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