• Please make sure you are familiar with the forum rules. You can find them here: https://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/index.php?threads/forum-rules.2334636/

MKB/AVT Availability Change Incoming

The MKB/AVT was only intended to be an option for assault classes. We've mistakenly enabled it as an option for every class with an option for an SMG. This adds an extra 6 or so MKBs/AVTs per side more than we intended (on a 64 player server). So we're going to patch this up later today, and you'll see significantly less of these weapons after that.

I knew it was unintentional! Thanks Ramm :)

Though, I'd have to say 2 is more than enough, 4-5 of these weapons on a map is still too much.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Yeah, one more post saying that 6 is still too much. Too much smgs and semiautos as it is...

I'm not picking on you, Raptus, but I'm a little tired of hearing this.

Can someone provide some direct proof that, tables from September '42 aside, SMG's weren't as common as bolts on the Stalingrad battlefield?

It just seems so counter to my (admittedly limited) reading of histories of the battle, all of which seem to proclaim it was a battle dominated by automatic weaponry: SMG's, LMG's, and HMG's.

Further to my point, when TWI and/or the modding community begin to expand out of recreations of Stalingrad battlegrounds and urban maps, we'll not only see the bolt-action rifles come alive but it will be an opportunity for level designers (both official and third-party) to apply different class restrictions since they are tied to the maps.

So, again, not a flaming or argumentative post here. Just wondering why folks feel like this many SMG's is "unrealistic" or not typical of what would have been seen in Stalingrad. :cool:
 
Upvote 0
Purely from a gameplay perspective that's still to many, just put them on the elite rifleman and be done with it.
Both weapons analogise best with the semi-auto rifle so having them there won't mess up balance. On the assault class it's just 6 more semi-autos on the Russian side and 6 more uber semi-autos on the Germans, leaving only 5 or so smgs a side!
 
Upvote 0
Ok in turn:


3) About having too many MkB's - the amount of MkB's when fixed is similar to the amount of STG's in Ostfront. It didn't ruin that game...

Just another voice out there in support of just 1-2 Mkbs/AVTs per team--hopefully in slots that cut away from the 6 assault positions.

In response to Ramm, it's true that on maps like Konigsplatz, Barashka(?), Danzig, Kurland(?), and Odessa back in the Ostfront days, the Axis had access to up to 6 StGs. However, the weapon was more believably present on those late-war battlefields, free-aim recoil was higher and penetration nonexistent making SMGs an equally viable option indoors, and the lack of a very noticeable suppression system meant that a cool-headed rifleman could concievably pick off an StG firing single shots in a medium to long range firefight.

In Heroes of Stalingrad, however, the penetration and recoil of the Mkb reflect its real-world properties.

On maps like Commissar's House, the Germans can cover the hallways indoors with ease. You, a Soviet, run out of cover, notice the fatal muzzle flash and report of the Mkb, duck behind the wall, and are blown away by the intermediate-caliber rounds smashing through wood and plaster.

At range, the Mkb has good accuracy and low recoil in single-shot mode, neither of which were true to the same degree with the Ostfront StG. Furthermore, at range the Mkb's fire seems to count towards suppression almost as much as rifle rounds, knocking an enemy's aim off considerably. A bolt-action can't match the same rate of fire or rate of suppression, allowing the Mkb to calmly line up the kill shot.

Those are significant differences between the RO2 and Ostfront incarnations of the assault weapons, notwithstanding realism issues. And if one wants to talk about Ostfront, I would argue that the StG played a large part in making the original Danzig so difficult for Russians to win without superior tactics. Any German in those corner ruins by Langermarkt, in the basement and lower floors of the Command Center, or covering the bridges could rack up an unholy score.

I may as well put in a word about the MP40/II while I'm at it. Taking a stable, controllable firing platform that can reach out to 100m and doubling it's length of sustained fire from 3.5 seconds to 7 will have a fair effect on gameplay as well. That slow chugging MP40 can concievably cover an entire street for 30 seconds or more with controlled bursts, wheras even with the drum magazine the PPSh will empty in 4.8 seconds, noticeable recoil included at that.

Again, given those gameplay concerns as well as the immersion-breaking factor, I have to say that I remain convinced that a severe limit on "Hero Weapons" is in order.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
HOS is different from OST......It's a new, different game.
A different, prettier but in a few key ways not nearly as good.

I like the movement system, I like (most) of the weapon handling (except MGs which lose out to every other auto weapon on most maps) but there's a bunch of things that just kill the immersion. Not least of which is trying to pretend it's 1942 when every man and his dog are running around with automatic weapons.
 
Upvote 0
I still think giving the weapon to the assault class, while a step in the right direction, would still result in far too many Mkb42s per side. It would make more sense historically and gameplay-wise to give them as an option for the elite rifleman class.
+1

Not read through the whole thread but if there is no Hero class then it has to be Elite Rifle and even then the class limit should be reduced a bit...
 
Upvote 0
The germans already have a BIG advantage on most maps. Having 4 assaults as opposed to the Soviets 6 will actually be balancing. (though that number is STILL not historically accurate)

The PPSH already suffers from nerfs as it is. Just make the PPSH work properly and reduce assault and rare weapon numbers. Is this too much to ask?
 
Upvote 0
Making the MkB as available as the STG44 in RO1 is not enough. In RO1, the StG wasn't nearly as good as it should have been because of gameplay limitations. In RO2, with its zoom and bullet penetration, the MkB is just blatantly superior to everything.


The same can be said for the PPSH.... its deadly too in the right hands.
 
Upvote 0
Making the MkB as available as the STG44 in RO1 is not enough. In RO1, the StG wasn't nearly as good as it should have been because of gameplay limitations. In RO2, with its zoom and bullet penetration, the MkB is just blatantly superior to everything.
unless ur SasQuatch who can control the insane recoil and rate of fire of the AVT.
Srsly this thing fires so fast that you have to be on target with the 1st shot, otherwise you will empty your whole mag b4 you can adjust, which is so pointless since SVT 1 shot kills anyway.. >.<
 
Upvote 0
I wonder if the devs have played on any public servers lately. Gameplay has significantly changed with the assault rifles. I think it is undeniably more Rambo arcade style with the german MkB's attacking like mad and dominating the scoreboards and battlefield mostly.

Now the change is there the question is: Do they like what they see?

I don't. It is fun at first but after a couple of hours not only the fun is slowly fading away but authenticity and realism which was so gripping in the first part of RO. In my opinion it does not feel like Stalingrad but some fictional battle between Spetsnaz Soviets and the prototype testing Waffen SS in a Stalingrad setting.
 
Upvote 0
Agree, Piscator.

I loved this game so much before the prototype scourge. I want to love it so much right now. really. but I can't get myself to play so much like I did before the rare weapons. something must be done. I think a good solution would be to just put a hard limit on it in Hardcore servers (or just get rid of it, really , I wouldn't shed a tear) and leave it as it is on "Relaxed" ones.
 
Upvote 0