I think everybody who plays RO can agree that the tanking in RO is odd, off, unrealistic or just plain retarded...For example the SU 76 (that thinly armored self propelled tin deathtrap) can consistantly take two 75 mm or two 88 mm to destroy. The first hit only catches it on fire. If the situation were reversed and the Germans had a Marder III taking two hits from a T-34/85 or IS 2 people would be raising hell on these forums.
The soviet death trap T60 with its impotent 20 mm weapon can easily penetrate the front 50 mm armor of the Panzer III L (go play Hedgehog) and Panzer IV F1 & 2. This is a blatant spit in the face of realism. Why did Tripwire do this? Are they lacking in technical info or cannon performance data? Does TW lack books or research? Did they think it would be badass or 'cool' to code an obsolete light anti infantry tank with overpowered cannon properties? Again, if the situation were reversed and the Germans had a Panzer II F with its 20 mm penetrating and destroying a 45 mm thick T-34 people would be screaming bloody murder on these forums.
Lastly, for the Panzer IV H vs the T34/76 & T34/85 anybody with a basic knowledge of tanks knows that both these versions of T34 retained the same basic frontal hull armor of 45 mm at 60 deg from vertical due to weight reasons. According to Schiffer's Panzertruppen, Osprey Publishing, and World War II Ballistics: Armor and Gunnery (and many others):
WWII Ballistics:Armor.....goes a bit further and states that up to 1,600 metres if perpendicular. Another book (Guderian's duck?) states that the soviets themselves rated the armor of the KV1 S as offering marginally superior frontal protection than that of the T34.
Unfortunately, in RO the Pz IV H's cannon performance is a joke. If you encounter even a SLIGHTLY angled T34/76/85 it will take incredible amounts of 75 mm frontal hits which will deflect without damage even as close as point blank. On top of this a correctly angled T34 will deflect multiple 88 mm even at point blank which is rediculous. The T34's 45 mm at 60 deg was good in 1941 against 50 mm rounds and less but because of round overmatch a 75 mm or larger round does not give a damn if the T34's armor is sloped at 60 deg because the armor is to thin to offer proper ballistic resistance. According to a report from specialists from the People's Commissariat for Tank Industry who examined 154 knocked-out T-34 tanks in several repair workshops in Aug 1942 they claim that 75 mm rounds vs T34's at various angles and ranges averaged a ratio of 70% of hits being dangerous and 30% being safe (non penetrating or non vital areas). For 88 mm hits 95% of hits were considered dangerous and only 5% safe. Sadly in RO, an angled T34 acts like its armored like an IS3. If TW can not get the mainstay Soviet/German tanks to behave realistically......what can one expect from RO2?
I primarily bought RO because of its promise of being a 'realistic tanking simulator' as stated on RO's website. Some time ago TW edited their website and removed this claim. When RO2 comes out and if it has vehicles it will primarily be Pz IV vs T34. Due to all the stuff written above there is a 90% chance I will not buy the game unless game footage on Youtube shows a dramatically improved tanking system.
You're right. Expecially about the T-34's and SU-76's armor that can resist from the 75mm L/48 and 88mm L/56 shots even from low distance........ridicolous. I agree with you.
But i don't like that you do the German fanboy......you have big knowledge in this camp, why don't you use this knowledge honestly and right? Be objective.
You can also say that is true that the 85mm ZiS-S-53 can penetrate the Tiger's 100mm frontal armor even at 500 meters, if the Tiger is not angled.......
....and that all Panzer III and Panzer IV models can be easily penetrated from 76.2mm F-34*, 85mm ZiS-S-53 and 122mm D-25T guns (
http://www.wwiivehicles.com/ussr/guns.asp) (* the F-34 gun cannot penetrate the frontal armor of late models of Panzer IV if they are angled (Ausf. H or later)).....
....and that the 30mm lateral armor of Panzer IV can be easily penetrated by ALL russian guns, that the Panther's 40mm lateral armor is not invincible as in RO* and, as the lateral armor of all Panzer IV/III, can be easily penetrated by ALL russian guns at every angle, and that the 85mm rounds shouldn't be deflected by the Panzers IV's 50mm turret armour, and that a Panther and Tiger cannot oneshot an angled IS2 from frontal (120mm @ 60 degrees), and that the 90mm lateral armor of IS2 hasn't the same resistance of the lateral armour of other german thanks........
*=
the Panther had a 80mm frontal plate, not a 60mm
and nearly invulnerable side armor is a thing i have encountered way too often in Ost, so i guess its a bug in the armor system
The T-34 became obsolete vs German armor in mid-late 1942 it never really recovered it only really shortened the technological (the Soviets knew this however their goal was production) the gap with the introduction of the T-34/85 which although it could contend with the German Panzers such as the late Panzer IV's (G,H,J) (which at this point had totally outstripped the 76mm (F-34) T-34 variants) these 85mm version T-34's remained in many ways inferior to these Panzer IV's until the close of WWII.
How is it possible? T-34/85 has better armor, better firepower and better mobility than Panzer IV G,H,J......
EDIT:
Another two things about the first part of my speech:
The first is that in RO the SdKfz 251 equipped with 75mm gun can take 2-3 shots from every russian gun (even from the 85mm) before die (this is the most ridicolous thing in RO
)
The second is that the additional shields (~20mm) with which the Panzer IV H is equipped are totally mistaken........these additional shields (in the sides of tank and around the turret) was projected to contrast the PTRD shots and the HEAT shots. In this way the shots explode before touching the (thin) armour of the tank. But i see in RO that the PTRD can penetrate the lateral armor of Panzer IV H....also that is very unrealistic.