Model 39 Grenade Project - Cpt-Praxius:

[Cpt-Praxius]

In relation to this thread:
http://forums.tripwireinteractive.co...ad.php?t=78147

I have begun working on the Model 39 Grenade for the Germans.

Not much to show just yet, but the easy part is done:


Next stage will be to add the additional features such as the Wing Nut and the belt ring on the bottom.... then texture. Current object is modeled in four pieces.... I wasn't silly enough to do it all in one chunk, as it needs to animate/work properly.

Maybe this choice of project was too easy

Total time spent so far:

45 mins.

[Clowndoe]

Originally Posted by Cpt-Praxius

Maybe this choice of project was too easy

Total time spent so far:

45 mins.

Easy for you maybe. I wouldn't know where to start.

Can't wait to try it.

[feldmarschall]

Becomes hard when you want to bring animations for it. And the RO2 animations are even harder to create than those in RO1.

[seb120]

I would recommend baking a normal map for it, im pretty sure all weapons in RO2 have them. Can you post some wireframes and current tri count? Good luck on your project!

[Jorg Biermann]

Egg Grenades!! W00!!!

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by seb120

I would recommend baking a normal map for it, im pretty sure all weapons in RO2 have them. Can you post some wireframes and current tri count? Good luck on your project!

Well there's no straight answer for that.

In the past I was concerned with going over poly counts for the UE2 Engine, rather than go full quality and then dumb it down to what it needed. This time around I'm going to design based on full quality ~ what it should look like and chop it down to the required polys afterwards.

Currently it is designed as a NURBS object to give me the full quality look without dealing with a huge poly/quad count while working, which will then be converted into Polys after I'm done. The great thing about Maya is that it's very easy to take an object and convert it to NURBS, Polys or SubDivs, and then back to SubDivs, Polys or NURBS at any time during the design process. In early versions of Maya, this wasn't so easy to do, and I don't know if 3D Studio Max has a similar ability that doesn't screw things up (as it's been a long time since I bothered to use that program), but that's one of the reasons why I like Maya.

Process to get to this point:

Went into Adobe Illustrator, laid out a side-profile diagram of the grenade, then created a vector line around the outside of one half of the image for each part of the grenade. I then removed the image from the file and exported the vector lines into a DXF file which was then imported into Maya 2012.

In Maya, I imported the file, then selected each vector line and went into Surfaces > Revolve, which is the quickest, easiest and most accurate method of getting this kind of shape imo.

I could have imported the side profile image of the grenade directly into Maya and then try to trace out half the grenade using the vector line tools in Maya, but I'm better with the tools in Illustrator, and am more accustomed to the alignment / snap-to / rulers in Illustrator for accurate tracing. I've also found there ends up being more steps involved when trying to do it all in Maya and takes up a bit more time, as you have to make a poly rectangle, try and get it to the proper ratio as the image you're going to use, then apply a planer map, select the color of that map and pick file, import the photo and hope nothing got skewed in the process. Then I have to play around with the curves/vector tools to trace around the image, which I find in Maya, they sometimes have a mind of their own when you move the vertex points around..... in Illustrator, I import the image, trace it.... export the file, done.

And I was incorrect on my time spent on the actual modeling in Maya above. I said 45 mins, but I was fiddling around with a few things for my own amusment at the time, so total time spent in Illustrator and in Maya to get the image you see above is actually around 15 mins.

As I go through this thread and the progression of this modeling, I will probably do what I did in the old RO Mod Forums with my Stug III, and make this thread as a tutorial for others modeling in Maya.

I'll back track a bit and go back to the start and provide screen shots and the step by step processes I use.

This project will use Adobe Illustrator, Adobe Photoshop and AutoDesk Maya 2012. Photoshop will be used for making textures, as well as modifying any diagrams and images I use for laying out models in Maya.... and Illustrator isn't actually necessary for people to use for modeling in Maya, but I use it anyways.

[Le0]

nice start will keep an eye on this

[Cpt-Praxius]

Most of the model is pretty well completed so far, with textures:



^ Still playing around with the texture for the "Wing Nut" and still have to make the little belt ring thing on the bottom.... then once those are all textured up, I'll just need to rig it up for animation.

Once I remembered wtf I was doing, it took me about an hour & a half from the time I left the model (shown in first image above) to what you see now in this new image.

Like I said, there's going to still be some tweaking to the model here and there, but I think it's coming along nicely.

BTW:

I have a few references thus far to use for this project, but in case anybody is wondering, I'm using this as a general guideline:

[worluk]

hm, i know the scheme you are using, but i have never seen the nade with a wingnut that wide.



And since I feel nostalgic, here the never released variants in some internal Carpathian Crosses beta, with different fuses


Great work on the normal map btw

[Extension7]

Cpt you said you were going to make a Molotov right? How exactly are you going to make it work in terms of the fire and such?

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by worluk

hm, i know the scheme you are using, but i have never seen the nade with a wingnut that wide.

IMG...

Well I based them on the top profile/diagram shown in both the image I supplied and the image you supplied, but as I said about still working on the texture of the wing nut, I figured I still need to tweak the model and round it off a bit more..... probably narrow off the ends a bit.

Originally Posted by Extremity

Cpt you said you were going to make a Molotov right? How exactly are you going to make it work in terms of the fire and such?

Can't say I planned that far ahead yet. I'll first work on the model and then probably setup some particle effect in Maya to produce the flames, but if there's an issue importing it into RO, then I'll see what already exists in the SDK and tweak it.

As for animations of the impact flame area when thrown, I've got a few ideas, but I'll be taking things a step at a time & trying not to get scattered all over the place before I need to.

Everything is possible to do, you just have to figure it out.... but for now, I'll be focusing on the modeling / texturing of the Model 39 Grenade.

Once that is modeled and textured properly, I'll start on the Molotov..... once both are ready with their design, then I'll work on their effects and animations.

[®omano]

great it starts looking good

[Fafnir_6]

You have no idea how awesome it is to see new weapons come out for this game, even if it is something as simple as a grenade. Do you plan on making the different fuse times available as a selection for the model 39? That would be very cool.

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

[Andrew Blake]

Found some more referances for you.

Spoiler!

Nades made to the forgotten hope 2 mod.

Spoiler!

Spoiler!

Found this when looking around:

Typically, a delay of around four seconds was used. The fuse is made in different delays times, indicated by the color of the cap:

• Red = 1 second

• Blue = 4.5 seconds

• Yellow = 7.5 seconds

• Gray = 10 seconds

Not sure if correct but I'm guessing so.


Anyway hope it helps some. Good luck.

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by Fafnir_6

You have no idea how awesome it is to see new weapons come out for this game, even if it is something as simple as a grenade. Do you plan on making the different fuse times available as a selection for the model 39? That would be very cool.

Cheers,

Fafnir_6

I was wondering myself if it was possible for it to have the typical 4 second delay as one option (Might just make it 3.5 seconds to mess with people)..... and have the alternative option of setting them up with instant fuses and drop them as bobby traps for anybody who picks them up & decides to use them.

But then pretty well nobody would want to pick them up, be that enemy or team mate

But you never know.... some people would probably try and take the chance, as not every player would rig them, so if they came across a dead enemy with the grenades rolling around near them, they basically could have a 50/50 chance of getting one that wouldn't go off on them.

However the 4 second grenade timer for these grenades basically means you gotta toss them almost as soon as you pull em, or they'd blow up in your hand or blow up in mid air if cooked too long.

And thanks for the resources Blake.... I didn't see the middle photo before, and the last one looks similar to what I saw online a few days ago.... I'm still fiddling around with the wing nut and trying to get it to my liking. Just didn't have much time today to do a lot on the model..... family day out and such.

[Coopsta]

Do you have any ideas on how your new grenade might work in terms of gameplay? Do you anticipate any aspects that differentiate it from current grenades?

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by Coopsta

Do you have any ideas on how your new grenade might work in terms of gameplay? Do you anticipate any aspects that differentiate it from current grenades?

Well the throw distance will be less, as you can throw a stick grenade better in general, but it's power would be slightly greater than the stick grenade. The Stick grenades have a 5 second time delay, while the Model 39 has approx a 4 second time delay.

The differences would be minimal, and it'd be more or less up to the player's own preference in what they'd want to use..... but I'm still thinking about having the different timers for each kind of grenade fuse, or if I should just leave it at the standard 4 second one.

Because of the slightly different focus of both grenades, those trying to take an objective with a pile of defending forces might want to use the stick grenade for longer distance with longer time delay.... and people like MG's, Marksmen, etc might want to choose the Egg to quickly toss down some stairs or around a door.

[CaptRanger]

Originally Posted by Cpt-Praxius

Well the throw distance will be less, as you can throw a stick grenade better in general, but it's power would be slightly greater than the stick grenade. The Stick grenades have a 5 second time delay, while the Model 39 has approx a 4 second time delay.

The differences would be minimal, and it'd be more or less up to the player's own preference in what they'd want to use..... but I'm still thinking about having the different timers for each kind of grenade fuse, or if I should just leave it at the standard 4 second one.

Because of the slightly different focus of both grenades, those trying to take an objective with a pile of defending forces might want to use the stick grenade for longer distance with longer time delay.... and people like MG's, Marksmen, etc might want to choose the Egg to quickly toss down some stairs or around a door.

Being able to setup booby traps on doors and such, like it says it was used for in the wiki article, would add a whole new gameplay element. Not sure how well it would be received with this cranky community, but it sure would be interesting...

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by CaptRanger

Being able to setup booby traps on doors and such, like it says it was used for in the wiki article, would add a whole new gameplay element. Not sure how well it would be received with this cranky community, but it sure would be interesting...

My guess would be that they used the red capped grenades with the 1 second fuse..... and while it probably wouldn't be impossible to add into the game, those traps would be equally deadly to both the enemy and your team.... and while one could use some highlighting effect for team mates, that wouldn't be all that real. Though it would have to force players to communicate better by telling their team that they rigged a specific area, and where so their team mates didn't wander through blindly and kill themselves.

I also have a few ideas on what I may do with the Molotovs and which classes would get them, etc.... but I'll do another thread specifically for the Molotov when I start working on that.

[Mike_Nomad]

Originally Posted by CaptRanger

Being able to setup booby traps on doors and such, like it says it was used for in the wiki article, would add a whole new gameplay element. Not sure how well it would be received with this cranky community, but it sure would be interesting...

Yep...... they're called "tripwires" and they were quite effective. Still in use today. That's how effective they are.