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Old 04-18-2012, 08:52 AM
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Default Clan activity

Reading through recent posts suggests that the much-heralded (by some players), classic mode will be released in the near future.

I would ask, perhaps a quick straw-poll, how many Clan's are still active in Red Orchestra? Not a clan-player playing - but a Clan playing as a Clan?

Without any structured league or ladder, I guess it is single figures?

Do Tripwire have any plans to stimulate Clan / Match play?

Perhaps another tournament or sponsored league/ladder?

I cannot see any long-term future or growth without involvement from the Clan scene and as most have walked away to play various other games, there must be something very attractive to make them return.

I understand that there are 'easy' / 'quick-fixes' etc.. like Free-Weekend deals or similar but these are unlikely to attract the more competitive players.

Clan play is not relevant to all the RO players, I understand that there is a significant player base that are neither interested nor will ever play in a Clan. That player base is not sufficient to maintain activity - this is clearly demonstrated by the high percentage of bots > player ratio.

It is my opinion that, with or without Classic-Mode, Clan activity provides longevity.
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Old 04-18-2012, 04:59 PM
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I guess the first thing that would need to be done is the teams left playing competitively should sign up and start a competition somewhere like clanbase esl twl whatever.

And then from that base work on. Personally I don't feel like starting something completely new from scratch especially after all the work done in the past with over 150 clans and 2000 players signing up for ROLadder, that pretty much all left the scene within 2 months of release.

Starting up a competitive community will be really slow and requires a lot of activity from whoever is trying to set it up (and he should not expect any real beneficial help from the community). It can be done and help from Tripwire could aid the process, but so far I have seen nobody trying to take the initiative and try to pull something off.
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Old 04-18-2012, 05:28 PM
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The Wolga Turnier / Tournament (Hardcore REALISM) CD-Modus is very much alive and kicking.

http://www.franzkaiser-clan.de/

http://forums.tripwireinteractive.co...ad.php?t=74845
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Old 04-20-2012, 07:59 AM
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Originally Posted by RAnDOOm View Post
The Wolga Turnier / Tournament (Hardcore REALISM) CD-Modus is very much alive and kicking.

This is excellent and I am very pleased that you guys are maintaining interest in the competitive scene.

I would have hoped for a TW reply but perhaps the Squad Discussion forum is not the best place.. .. ..

Does anyone else have any idea's or suggestions as to how we can re-generate leagues / ladders / competitions?

Zets, having known you for some years, I fully understand and am sympathetic towards your position. I feel that if RO2 is in the hands of the reduced player-base to create competition - it will not happen.



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Old 04-20-2012, 11:31 AM
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It might be a very good idea to have some organization going on when the free weekend hits, so people interested in competitive RO2 know where to go.
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Old 04-20-2012, 12:25 PM
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A big meeting with everybody left, to get things going and organized together would be a good start.
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Old 04-20-2012, 12:49 PM
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"With everybody left . . . "

Mmmm.......this group of players have become disheartened and lack any motivation.

There are many individual players that will offer support & perhaps contribute, but I am sure, as you well know Zets, that when it comes to actually putting the work down . . the numbers drop to zero.

I do not think this approach will gather any momentum.

That said, what else do we have?

Tripwire have not continued any marketing strategy to encourage growth and the competitive scene has, despite the early encouraging comments, only been allowed the Scorched Earth Tournament.

I am asking Tripwire to qualify any plans they may have to stimulate Clan gaming. A huge amount of manpower and time has been taken to create the new-build and I am not confident that the time spent will actually provide any tangible results for competition.
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Old 04-20-2012, 01:44 PM
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The big question is what sort of help from Tripwire do you think is necessary.

There was supposedly still money tucked away from ROLadder, if you start something on esl or clanbase (IMO rather esl than clanbase, and never use their ladder systems because they suck :P). Then with some discussion you can probably obtain that price money.

The thing is that if there is anything that the competitive community needs, then it is good tools for competitive play and marketing for competitive play more so than actual prices in my opinion.

Basically getting player based demo recordings to work, and adding options for admin staff to properly fast forward and rewind demos to go back to that important bit. And to whatever new poeple and clans try it out, make it clearly that there is a place where they can play competitively.

----

If nobody steps up and takes the ropes in hands, then tripwire will likely never make a step either. Of course FH could perhaps create regular competition but they are not really tailored or experienced with direct clan play. Which is why I think in that case going with ESL would be better.

The Wolga Turnier / Tournament is a nice initiative, although for that to work they would need and be willing as a tournament to fully separate the actual tournament from the frans kaiser clan to become an independent entity.

---

If anyone starts anything and needs help with scoring systems that actually statistically make sense. Then I'm willing to offer my help.

But again try getting together with some clans pick a representatitve for the existing community. And then have a private chat with someone like Ramm. That will get you more than asking in the forums ^^.
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Old 04-25-2012, 02:59 AM
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We meet up on the regular several times a week. We also have had many friendly scrims with other groups. All in in all, it has been a fun time!

Come check us out at LMCgaming.com !
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Old 04-25-2012, 08:47 AM
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Thanks for you reply Omni....

Although you play friendly wars on a regular basis, my point is that this is not sustainable. There will always be the 'odd' group of players or clans that continue to play games that are considered 'dead'. I am sure there are clan's still playing Medal Of Honor - Allied Assault.

PCW's and friendly wars are great in support of a competitive scene, not a replacement.

I would hope that you guys would recognise that to continue playing RO2, it is critical that new players & clans are introduced.

Thanks for the offer to 'check you out'; the difference in playing times and ping issues make this a little unattractive but I wish you continued success with your team.


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Old 05-18-2012, 05:33 PM
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Hello All,

I belong to a group called "Stalingrad Bridge Club" Our tagz are {sBc} . Although we are not a clan we have 21 members who play RO2 regular. The only time we get to scrim is vs LMC(4F) and ITAK. So I try and have 2 scrims a wk, but it is even difficult to scrim vs EU guys. The clan activity sux!!!!!!! Anyone wants to scrim let me know. My steam name is
{sBc} HORSE ><>
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Old 05-18-2012, 09:20 PM
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Well, I head up the RO branch at F|H and we've worked very hard on the "Turning Point" Campaign, but atm it's on standby. I want/need the game to be more polished and more types of equipment and maps before we proceed. With this, plus a community that fled in droves, i'm not holding my breath until the outlook is better for this game.
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Old 05-20-2012, 07:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Metalbourne View Post
Well, I head up the RO branch at F|H and we've worked very hard on the "Turning Point" Campaign, but atm it's on standby. I want/need the game to be more polished and more types of equipment and maps before we proceed. With this, plus a community that fled in droves, i'm not holding my breath until the outlook is better for this game.
Ideally for a game everything is perfect, but at some point its important to look at things realistically as well. In case of starting that campaign.

- Like what exactly would you need and why would you need it. (primarily what is the bare minimum required)
- What are the things you could create and put together yourself / with additional staffmembers
- And for what would you need TWI.

I'm primarily asking since from my perspective new maps are really nice as well are additional features. But in terms of competition they mostly are more beneficial in terms of marketing value and bringing/keeping in more players rather than a necessity. Which is exactly why I was wondering, everybody got dreams but in the end often compromises have to be made.

At the moment the competitive community seems to lie pretty much flat on its face (both clan based as well as realism). And will require a lot of effort from any website getting to kickboot it back the life. Which is why I think it's important to focus first on the minimum requirements to just get some things out there.

If the new patch is going to get a lot of marketing free weekends etc, then that is probably the only shot the game got at getting more competitive play back on its feet. Meaning a professional although possibly simple place should be on its feet at the time the free weekend hits.
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Old 05-21-2012, 09:24 AM
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It would be interesting to hear what game mode and type people think should be best and most interesting for competitive play after the big patch.

I have to say that I would probably be most interested in classic game type and territory game mode. I personally prefer countdown but I think it will be too disconnected with the public community to easily enough recruit new members to clans.
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Old 05-24-2012, 08:27 AM
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The 'revitalised' community seems pretty excited about the new release.

I hope that the competitive scene will be resurrected and perhaps a league or ladder will be created.

I am still of the opinion that without competition and/or clans, the game will not have any longevity.




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Old 05-24-2012, 12:41 PM
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You never know..
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Old 05-24-2012, 09:54 PM
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Quote:
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You never know..
Hey Butch, what modes are you guys gonna be running?
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Old 05-25-2012, 07:56 AM
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I could'nt possibly confirm or deny rumours of any future competition site/organization that may or may not appear in the near future..
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Old 05-27-2012, 07:26 AM
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If you guys start a site please think of the following things.

1) Try out your scoring system before actual clans play on it with real based clan data. And actually check if after a while to see that the scores actually converge to a point that makes sense.

With elo for instance its not uncommon that winning twice against the lowest ranked team gives you the same amount of points as winning once against the highest ranked clan. This causes a lot of bullying of lower clans to obtain points, as you can become NR1 by simply playing loads of matches against weaker clans. The ranking should show the strongest clan at the NR1 position, not what clan plays the most or wins the most total matches.

And in case of using a rung based system make sure its a hop over system. If the top team wins don't do anything, but if the bottom team wins place that bottom team over the team it won against don't make them swap places.

A score system will always aim to show how strong a certain clan is over another clan by placing them in a ranking. Which means that the score system can be used to predict the outcome of a match as well. When you have results predict some outcomes using the system and look whether they actually make sense.

2) In a competitive setting be it in games, or on the sports field people playing to win will and are expected to play at the boundary of the rules. If you cannot monitor and police a rule don't add it in there. And if you add a rule make the exact boundaries clear. For instance with a rule like no spawn killing define what you exactly mean by spawn killing. And define the boundary taking into account someone accidentally doing something wrong for a second, vs doing it on purpose.

People will play by the rules exactly as written, and will always find grey areas to gain an advantage and rightfully so. Don't expect any gentleman's codes or base rules on a general perception of what is right or wrong. State it exactly.

Heck work together with people that have experience in playing or admining competitions. Even if its people from cod bf3 or any other fps game. Or perhaps even rts games.

3) For the love of god make a website with as key focus navigation and actually giving information you want. No loud blasting dramatic music, biblical references, and multiple intros (that can freeze your computer) and requiring multiple clicks to get the information you want.

4) Do not trust clanleaders, they logically mostly care about their own team doing well rather than having your site be neutral

5) Wherever possible do not try to reinvent the wheel, and base your rules on those of other websites. Some rules while they do not immediately show why they are added, often have their roots into situations that occured. However never blatantly copy and paste pieces of text due to copyright issues.

Having seen the work required to create a website that can functionally compete with websites like clanbase twl esl etc. Especially since a single game site can never obtain similar marketing advantages as a big site that offers multiple games. I would just sign up to start a competition at ESL or Clanbase, and make use of their existing player base.
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Old 05-27-2012, 01:53 PM
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Well said zets =).
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