Something that worries me slightly.

[Giuliano]

I've decided to start playing Ostfront and DH again, for nostalgic reasons and because I enjoyed both games immensely. I can't say either of them are dead, because there is atleast one full server full of regulars.

One thing I noticed is the sheer volume of die-hard RO1 and DH players who are blissfully unaware of the progress RO2 has made since its launch. Very many of them don't even know the classic mode is being made let alone being tested. It saddens me because the Classic mode truely has the potential to bring back some of the players that RO2 lost.

[MarioBava]

I don't think that's all that worrisome. While RO2 is in a state where it could use all the (good) players it could get, 1 or 2 full 50 (or less) man servers in RO1 or DH I don't think is indicative of anything in particular; especially if those people are blissfully unaware of what is going on in RO2 (that means they apparently never cared enough to check in on progress or knew enough about TWI to even know there would be progress). Besides, it's a reality of PC gaming that previous games get played even after the new game is out. That's pretty normal. It doesn't even mean all those people actually tried or ever will try RO2. I myself have done this. Buy a game when it is dirt cheap after the sequel has come out, but never go to the sequel. It'd be great if those people can and do join or rejoin RO2 community, but if they don't, they don't.

[oldslowguy]

Just mention the RO2 progress etc in the public chat when you are playing RO1 or DH, without getting pushy. My 2 cents

Originally Posted by oldslowguy

Just mention the RO2 progress etc in the public chat when you are playing RO1 or DH, without getting pushy. My 2 cents

So does this mean RO II player counts are so low one has to go back to the old RO I in an attempt to leach players from them? Or in other words, when one is playing in-game (DH) and concentrating on playing, one (especially admins) does not like useless, distracting spam on voice/chat about unrelated RO II stuff.



.

[Nikita]

A lot of the people still in DH or RO:Ostfront (though certainly not everyone) are limited by hardware, and literally haven't even bought RO2 or tried it yet because they can't run it. I know several players at least for which that is the case.

[Torio]

Not concerned. Once the game is polished, press releases will be sent out and Tripwire will roll with their standard dog and pony show. If the game is good, the players will come.

New players.

I doubt TWI would be investing time and treasure at this point without a plan to generate new revenue. Patience.

[Dr.Phibles]

did you realise how bad RO1 and DH actualy are when playing them again, i played Dh not long ago and cudnt believe how much effort it ook to get over walls and generaly take cover while getting shot at

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by Dr.Phibles

did you realise how bad RO1 and DH actualy are when playing them again, i played Dh not long ago and cudnt believe how much effort it ook to get over walls and generaly take cover while getting shot at

Yeah, I was less impressed with DH than I was with RO1.... DH has a lot of content, but spawn bunkers don't help things, and many elements / models / animations in DH really bugged me.

The last time I tried to play DH for any length of time, I found my favorite weapon (Sten MK II) had sights that blocked most of your view of the target and the muzzle flash basically made you lose any tracking of your target.... and the Thompson wasn't much better...... and the fact that the majority of the servers I could find basically focused on nothing but US vs. German, I lost interest quickly, as I've played way too many FPS's that revolved around the US, and US weapons (Medal of Honor, Call of Duty, Day of Defeat, etc.) Yes there are Canadian/British forces in DH, but again, trying to find a decent server that offered those forces was hard to find.

The model for the Sten MKII bugged the hell out of me too.... I've handled a Sten MKII a few times as my father had one in his WWII Collection, and comparing the DH Sten to the Sten I held in my hands, the DH Sten looked like a thin metal pipe, 3/4 the actual size it should have been..... and as mentioned before, the sights on the DH Sten were horribly done.

Heck back in the mod days of RO, I decided to model my own Sten MKII (and MKV):

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/h...us1/img-09.jpg

And while I could have pumped up the polys and add more detail to my model when I had more time, it's still a lot closer to the real thing than the DH Sten:

http://darkesthourgame.com/screensho...ten_hipped.jpg

Just the perspective of most of the DH weapons were just.... bad..... many of them were really thin, yet really long. The friggin ammo clip shown above was almost as long as the weapon. So many people hammer on how much realism was in DH..... but they couldn't even get the weapons looking right, not to mention the excessive muzzle flashes.

[[Mad_Murdock]]

Thats an impressive looking Sten there man. Did you draw the textures yourself or did you use a photo as a base, because I could never get those right. To be honest though, I have little experience with 3D modeling for this kind of thing. Ironic as I use AutoCAD and SolidWorks all the time if you're familiar with them. Even more unlikely, I have a half-finished Sten MkII model myself that I did in SolidWorks as part of my design portfolio, I got through the exterior and the clip, but never finished the trigger mechanism or the bolt, that thing is a beastly work of machining, ill post it up though if i find the files.

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by [Mad_Murdock]

Thats an impressive looking Sten there man. Did you draw the textures yourself or did you use a photo as a base, because I could never get those right.

I created the textures from scratch in Photoshop based on various photos and my memory of my father's Sten MKII.

The model isn't really par with today's in-game models, as it was designed for UT2004/RO:CA era modeling, thus I cut some corners such as the details on the side of the Sten being just textured on (not modeled) in order to keep below the 5000 poly count that was the average back then.

I find trying to modify photos is more trouble than it's worth compared to doing it from scratch, as lighting & angles can screw the look of the model when brought into the actual game, which uses in-game lighting & shading to do all that.... having shading in the texture can mess up the overall look.

To be honest though, I have little experience with 3D modeling for this kind of thing. Ironic as I use AutoCAD and SolidWorks all the time if you're familiar with them.

I used AutoCAD before, but over a decade ago when I was in a Mechanical Drafting course (AutoCAD 2000).... since then I hardly touched AutoCAD and pretty well forget how to use it now, lol. I've seen SolidWorks and I think I used it a couple of times, but my knowledge in that program is even less.

My experience in 3D Modeling/Animation is mostly in Maya and 3DS Max. (Mostly Maya though)

Even more unlikely, I have a half-finished Sten MkII model myself that I did in SolidWorks as part of my design portfolio, I got through the exterior and the clip, but never finished the trigger mechanism or the bolt, that thing is a beastly work of machining, ill post it up though if i find the files.

Cool.... it'd be interesting to see, but I never bothered with all the mechanics of the trigger or bolt system, as you'd never see that stuff in-game anyways

[Sonicpanda]

Originally Posted by Giuliano

Very many of them don't even know the classic mode is being made let alone being tested.

As one of those oldschool people, I think many of us do know but it still isn't good enough. The main problem I've heard is the maps. In original RO and DH, modders made large scale combined arms maps that really gave you a feeling of being in a huge conflict. The current maps are a fraction of what we love, and it just feels cramped and too fast paced. The realism is great, but the pacing is just way off and reminds me more of mainstream games than RO. The old maps also had a feeling of a frontline. I don't know how to really explain it, but there were always certain areas that both teams would come to a standstill in and it would be the most intense fighting. Breaking through the enemies frontline was the greatest feeling. Maybe I just haven't played enough, but in RO2 it doesn't feel like there is much of a frontline. I'll be with some teammates in a shootout with the enemies, when somebody runs up and shoots me in the back. It just felt more like some kind of halo style deathmatch, where you cruise around the map and try to shoot up single enemies.

Once the devs release the new tanks and transports, if add some big maps then you'll see people coming back. I preordered the game, played it for a while, then gave up on it. I still check back to see the progress, but it still doesn't do it for me enough to play routinely.

[jackrabbitslim7]

I still play RO1 on a regular basis and it's a ton of fun, but I play RO2 too. I can enjoy both and even darkest hour, it's not because there is still players on ro1 than they are not playing RO2 too. Both games are greats, no one is more realistic than the other, they are different so I see nothing to be worried about.

Originally Posted by Dr.Phibles

did you realise how bad RO1 and DH actualy are when playing them again, i played Dh not long ago and cudnt believe how much effort it ook to get over walls and generaly take cover while getting shot at

I find RO1 and DH still enjoyable, and taking cover is easier since you will not face the "can't prone here" message

[>< f4ct0r...13]

I predict (again), that the classic mode (no matter how much I welcome it) will split the community again.

Some will stay with realism, others classic. I for one, won't have both games on my system.

A great example of how it will break the community. The most popular server is taking votes on what mode to play. I fear that the only server that can stay consistently full will now have its population halved.

[Sonicpanda]

Originally Posted by >< f4ct0r...13

Some will stay with realism, others classic.

But then there are people like me who will either play classic or nothing. And the main reason there aren't players is because of the big flop on release, with all the bugs and problems. I remember on release day there were thousands of players, now it seems like it doesn't break 100.

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by Sonicpanda

But then there are people like me who will either play classic or nothing. And the main reason there aren't players is because of the big flop on release, with all the bugs and problems. I remember on release day there were thousands of players, now it seems like it doesn't break 100.

And while you'll only play Classic, I'll only play the two existing game modes..... and when the existing servers decide to pick one or the other, everybody's options of servers running what they want will be reduced even further, which will most likely create a number of new problems.

Originally Posted by Cpt-Praxius

not to mention the excessive muzzle flashes

Update your version of DH:

5.1 Log:

*All third person weapon meshes are now scaled correctly and attached to players’ hands in the proper place.

*Reduced size of first person muzzle flashes on the following weapons...

Originally Posted by >< f4ct0r...13

I predict (again), that the classic mode (no matter how much I welcome it) will split the community again. Some will stay with realism, others classic.

A problem of their own doing. Classic should have logically superseded the so-called 'realism' mode.

[Cpt-Praxius]

Originally Posted by Field Marshal Rommel

.... A problem of their own doing. Classic should have logically superseded the so-called 'realism' mode.

http://images.wikia.com/bigbangtheor...3c/Leonard.jpg
"Supersedes!"

And no it shouldn't have... I enjoy both Relaxed and Realism.... I don't like RO Classic.

[Piscator]

The relaxed realism and realism difference is too small to justify the separation into these modi imho. Relaxed realism is really too close to many other titles with the radar etc. For all I care one of those could be scrapped but it is all about choice. If servers run any of these 3 modes successfully then that is good. Give people a choice, that's what makes PC games special.
I personally see myself in the classic mode only as I do not care for unlocks and also I am not a fan of Amphetamines (and realism mode seems to supply the players' avatars with plenty of that).

Playing classic reminds me how disturbing the enemy weapon loadout is. One of the worst design choices ever! It takes away sooo much and because of the fast gameplay in the current modes the enjoyment of playing them wears off much quicker. I don't need immature players looking for the best K/D ratio or most kills etc. I'd like the feeling of teamplay for the sake of teamplay and winning together. Scrap the kill counter in classic!
So the community will be split but I guess if everyone can choose what they want there is no harm and several servers will be populated during the evenings. Don't forget that RO always attracted a bit more mature gamers and we tend to have to work...