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Whats up with M14

With an M14? Are you kidding?

The current 300 capacity is enough to be spam happy on Suicidal and only maybe run out towards the end if you went completely over the top. I've been there a few times when i felt like a bit of M14 spamming and that was on Offices where you're guaranteed for every single 1 of the 250+ enemies to come through you. It is nigh impossible to pick up the M14 and not wind up just spamming it purely because the capability is there and theres absolutely no drawbacks to it.

Problem with the M14 isn't just its recoil, ammo capacity, damage, rate of fire, etc. Its the weight aswell. You can take a LAR or DHC with it too which gives you even more ammunition.

I mean as a general SS with a LAR or Handcannon
as i have mentioned before, i don't use the M14...
 
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Every game has a box, and two kinds of players who think outside of it: the best, who know where the box is and how it works so they can safely leave it, and the worst, who have no idea where it is and wander about arbitrarily.

A game can be flawed by making the box too big, which makes things confusing and directionless, or (as far too many games are nowadays that aren't explicitly marketed as "sandbox") too small, leaving only a few pre-optimized paths to follow and player discretion being mostly limited to cosmetic choices and outright exploits.

I happen to think KF's status quo has a perfectly decent size.


And now, a few less abstract points that suggest to me what the implicit box size in KF is, in contrast to what you think it should be:
  • Everybody spawns with a pistol, a knife, grenades, and a syringe and welder.
  • There are no hard limits to any equipment purchase, merely discounts and bonuses. (EDIT: In fact there is one, but it's a generalized encumbrance system which underscores the point even more.)
  • Most of the maps do not have obvious "the sharpie stands here to snipe, the spec needs to weld doors A and B within this time frame to protect the medic, etc." spots, but are generally open-ended and much is left up to interpretation.
  • You can switch perks between any two waves without any notice to anyone else.
  • When you switch perks, you keep all the equipment you had acquired before the switch.
  • Perks are not bound to any character appearance, so a player can keep their look and maintain a generally continuous visual identity throughout a game however often they switch perks.
  • You can level up a perk without actually playing it.
  • They're called Perks not Classes.
 
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(I couldn't be bothered to start a new thread on this, so I just did a string search for "m14" on each page on the forum until I found this thread.)

I'm going to take back everything I've said about the M14's lousy sights... I've found it way easier to make accurate shots with it than the LAR (which, for me, has an aimpoint consisting of a single pixel in the middle of a big clumsy-looking circle... by the time a zed is far enough away to be worth using rifle sights instead of firing point-blank, using a pistol or closing in with an axe, where that one pixel is is extremely difficult to see.)
 
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(I couldn't be bothered to start a new thread on this, so I just did a string search for "m14" on each page on the forum until I found this thread.)

I'm going to take back everything I've said about the M14's lousy sights... I've found it way easier to make accurate shots with it than the LAR (which, for me, has an aimpoint consisting of a single pixel in the middle of a big clumsy-looking circle... by the time a zed is far enough away to be worth using rifle sights instead of firing point-blank, using a pistol or closing in with an axe, where that one pixel is is extremely difficult to see.)
I feel the opposite. The ironsights on the m14 are horrible. I much prefer the LAR, although i would rather just spam my 9mm or HC as SS than use the EBR.

The thing is, when you spam with the EBR, everything dies before you can get a headshot, when you spam with the pistols, you can get bodyshots until you get the headshot! Talk about effective ways of leveling a perk!
 
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Every game has a box, and two kinds of players who think outside of it: the best, who know where the box is and how it works so they can safely leave it, and the worst, who have no idea where it is and wander about arbitrarily.

A game can be flawed by making the box too big, which makes things confusing and directionless, or (as far too many games are nowadays that aren't explicitly marketed as "sandbox") too small, leaving only a few pre-optimized paths to follow and player discretion being mostly limited to cosmetic choices and outright exploits.

I happen to think KF's status quo has a perfectly decent size.


And now, a few less abstract points that suggest to me what the implicit box size in KF is, in contrast to what you think it should be:
  • Everybody spawns with a pistol, a knife, grenades, and a syringe and welder.
  • There are no hard limits to any equipment purchase, merely discounts and bonuses. (EDIT: In fact there is one, but it's a generalized encumbrance system which underscores the point even more.)
  • Most of the maps do not have obvious "the sharpie stands here to snipe, the spec needs to weld doors A and B within this time frame to protect the medic, etc." spots, but are generally open-ended and much is left up to interpretation.
  • You can switch perks between any two waves without any notice to anyone else.
  • When you switch perks, you keep all the equipment you had acquired before the switch.
  • Perks are not bound to any character appearance, so a player can keep their look and maintain a generally continuous visual identity throughout a game however often they switch perks.
  • You can level up a perk without actually playing it.
  • They're called Perks not Classes.

Deep, and your points make sense. +1



Anyway, I see a lot of people saying to nerf the Sharpie himself, when all that's really needed is to nerf the M14 (I'd say his other weapons are balanced atm). I would decrease body damage significantly but at the same time increase the gun's headshot multiplier, so it's less effectual spammed into a crowd, but better at the Sharpshooter's actual job, taking down larger enemies. Except that the M14 does it with 3-4 quick headshots instead of a single crossbow snipe, which makes it actually harder to use to take down Scrakes/FP then the crossbow (contrary to what the dime-a-dozen pub Sharpies think) but has alright (though hopefully still not too great) crowd-control to compensate, if used skillfully with multiple quick headshots on Husks/Gorefasts and the like.
 
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Thanks.

I'd say the current damage done by an M14 headshot is fine, possibly a tiny bit low if we're going to justify the huge price increase over the bow, but generally I have an easier time with it than the xbow because I'm not suddenly interrupted by my view totally changing between shots and there's a lot less pressure to get the first shot right (which means my first shot is way more likely to hit).

(Come to think of it this might also explain why I think the M14's sights are easier to use than the LAR's... but then again, I have this issue even with a lone siren 50m away, and of course I find the bow easier to use than the LAR.)

Generally if the M14 were to be to sharpie and bow what the katana is to zerk and axe now, I probably wouldn't be complaining.
 
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Generally if the M14 were to be to sharpie and bow what the katana is to zerk and axe now, I probably wouldn't be complaining.

I wouldn't be against the M14 going either way in regards to power/price ratio. Either cheaper but weaker or stronger (when headshotting consistently) but same price or slightly more expensive. I don't think the M14 should be outright better then the bow though. I think they should be 2 sub-specializations for Sharpie (if you've ever played Battlefield 2142, like the 2 unlock weapons for each class).

Xbow: High spike damage with little to no crowd control. Builds on the Sharpie's existing strengths and takes them to their logical extremes.

M14: Lower spike damage with moderate crowd control. Balances out Sharpie but dulls his strengths somewhat (though he still leans toward spike damage even with this gun. Just less so.).




Off-topic, I honestly think the AA12 in particular is not worth it price/power-wise (4000 unperked?). Unless you have max discount of course. I wouldn't mind seeing the AA12/HS display a similar dynamic. But then blurring tiers could easily have disastrous effects on game balance so take it with a grain of salt.


The AK is also a tad underpowered to it's price when unperked too imo.

The Scar & Crossbow are on the opposite end of that spectrum. Very useful for not too much dosh.
 
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