Perk Solutions

[Anubis_FB]

First I want to add that I am new to the KF forums, but I have been in other game forums before, but with so many people wanting the perks to change, I ask... Why???
Berzerker
With the Berzerker Perk, I have been hearing people complaining about the weapons, and the decap.

Commando
Compaints about the SARC and the level system have been poppin up, but they have been working on it and if you look at it from now and then, progression is way better.

Demolitionist
There is a few posts about this class, but it is the new class, no comments from me till it gets the "bugs" worked out.

Firbug
I have seen alot of people complaining about the one and only weapon the Firebug has. There is alot of solutions to the problem, but adding another flamethrower in the game isnt one of them.

Marksmen
The "all powerful" class atm. So far all I have heard is people complaining about how they should take away and not adjust the class to make it more viable to do other things besides use your pistol till the big guys come and use Xbow.

Medic
No complaints I can see about a medic. Glitch, but no complaints.

Support Sepcialist
Alot of people want the class nerfed, but to take you have to give, because not only will you be hurting the people who enjoy the support class just for being support, it will only be because they brought the Demo class to the game.

PLZ feel free to post any other threads of complaints here and solutions to the problems

 

[DocDave]

First I want to add that I am new to the KF forums, but I have been in other game forums before, but with so many people wanting the perks to change, I ask... Why???

As to the "why," here are my opinions.

Berserker and Firebug: The only two perks not to receive new weapons with the latest update. The new weapons are considerably more powerful, thus rendering these two perks much weaker than before in comparison. In addition, both of these are somewhat one-dimensional in options.

Commando and Support: These two perks received new, powerful weapons that make them stronger overall. In my opinion, however, their new weapons are still balanced enough that they somewhat need to rely on others in the team for tasks they do not excel at. Maybe.

Demolitionist: The new perk. Still not sure what to think of it, but although it is quite strong, it has a definite need for team support in regards to it's inability to handle close range combat effectively.

Medic: The new weapon allowed the medic to heal at range, but is not powerful in terms of damage, this being the main cause of any complaints about the medic.

Sharpshooter: It's new weapon allows rapid rate of fire coupled with very high damage, and at better range than the commando. In addition to it's traditional role as "boss killer" this perk can now obliterate groups quickly as well, effectively eliminating the need for a balanced team composition. Previously the massive damage a SS could inflict was balanced by their inability to handle large groups of zeds, for which they relied on other perks: firebug, support and commando. Now a team of 6 SS is not only viable but easy mode.

 

[BEEEEEES]

...all in my opinion, only.

Berserker: All other melee weapons were totally eclipsed by the katana. No other loadout for berserkers even remotely approaches the efficacy of a Katana paired with a crossbow. Leans heavily on the use of non perk-related ranged weapons/team due to the sheer number of specimens melee stacks up poorly against. No crowd control. No clear combat role.

Firebug: Well, it sometimes gets boring shooting puffs of flame. Ammo supply is too limited for suicidal difficulty, even with rank 6. Not a lot of balance-related complaints here.

Commando and Support: Meh, pretty balanced I say. SCAR and AA are really powerful, true, but they have their drawbacks and I personally feel they're pretty close to golden.

Demolitionist: Smoke-screen haters Just like the firebug, a demo that shoots when he doesn't need to hurts the team's visibility big-time. The class does incredible damage, but they're awful in the short-range. Pretty close to golden I say.

Medic: I wish you got some money for healing people

Sharpshooter: too much crowd-control on this perk's weapons. One-shotting FP's is...silly.

 

[Nanostrike]

Medic: I wish you got some money for healing people

Sharpshooter: too much crowd-control on this perk's weapons. One-shotting FP's is...silly.

You DO get money for heals. Just not a lot.

And being able to 1-shot even FPs with the Crossbow is, quite simply, gamebreaking. NO other class can even compare to that; being able to take out an FP at beyond-safe range without making more than the tiniest dent in your ammo...

The Berserker's only weapon of choice is the click-spammy Katana and the Firebug is still limited to the Flamethrower.

Support and Commando, IMO, finally found their niches (Though Support doesn't need the LAW anymore and their grenade damage bonus kinda overlaps with Demomen...). And Medic is a solid supporting class now.

Patch overdid Sharpshooter by a good margin, gimped Firebug and Zerker simply by upping everyone BUT them, and balanced everyone else.

 

[[UIT] Akame]

With the husk and FP decap removal being the only notable update for the specs I think that, in general, the player is vastly overpowered at this point.

With the removal of the FP decap (and, consequently, the fix for FP hit box) Sharp Shooter definitely got the best deal since the FP used to be an issue since they didn't get the huge heatshot bonus and the scrake used to get stunned often (but not so much since zerkers are underrepresented).

The commando got the SCAR and Support got AA12, both of which are adequate late game weapons, even against FPs and scrakes

I don't have a good opinion of demolisions since he doesn't mesh with the team as well but he has moderate power and decent weapons.

Medic got ranged healing and class weapon, upgrading from marginal to ok.

Zerker lost chainsaw and got annoying click-spam and got marginalized by comparison.

Firebug still hasn't got a new weapon and it's enemy, the husk, is not robust enough to really warrant any playing of firebug to counter him.

 

[DocDave]

Firebug still hasn't got a new weapon and it's enemy, the husk, is not robust enough to really warrant any playing of firebug to counter him.

This is really hardly a boost to firebug anyway - have you tried killing a husk with the flamethrower? What a joke...

 

[Nanostrike]

This is really hardly a boost to firebug anyway - have you tried killing a husk with the flamethrower? What a joke...

Demo and, to a lesser extent, the line-damaging Support and X-Bow Sharpshooters minimized the impact of Firebug.

And combined with EVERYONE being able to down Scrakes now (Even medics with Crossbows 1-shot them!), the Zerker nerfs made the class suck pretty hard in general. It no longer having a purpose on a team is just the poop icing on the crap cake...

 

[Anubis_FB]

With the FP decap, I have been thinkin about that, and to kind of balance it out with Zerker and Marksman vs. FP here is my solution. Make the decap possible for Marksmen in its current state at long range, but the chances for decap is reduce as he gets closer. Make the zerker built to handle them with a Chainsaw. Increase the Melee damage to FP while using the Chainsaw.
Example If your bunkering in the police station in west-london, a FP lined up in the allyway by the trader will have the same chance to decap as it does now. Making the Marksmen have to take the shot at a distance to decap. If he tries at closer range, the chances of decap are smaller and a Melee weapon will be needed. Zerker will have to take out a FP.

 

[Anubis_FB]

As for the Firebug, I think they should get something. Thats part of the problem is everyone know it should be something, but nobody knows what. I suggested Greek fire, so the fire that stays after they should would stay longer. This would be a land mine kind of thing they shoot on the ground and ignite. Others can use it and ignite with there welder I guess, but its an idea other than a flame thrower

 

[DocDave]

As for the Firebug, I think they should get something. Thats part of the problem is everyone know it should be something, but nobody knows what.

There are a number of suggestions floating around. Yeah, there doesn't seem to be much agreement on it, true. Anyway, off the top of my head some more of the ideas vaguely regarding FB balance are, in rough order of how well I like them, poorest to best:

• Stronger welder for Firebug that functions as a good melee tool.
• Fire axe easily usable for Firebug. (I actually like, but not a balance fix at all)
  
• Flaregun a la Team Fortress 2.
• Remake the Husk weapon into the next FB weapon.
• Incendiary bullets for FB per Left 4 Dead 2.
• An "upgrade" of flamethrower with more firepower/penetration/etc.
• Let the flamethrower shoot unignited liquid on the ground to light up later.
• Let the Firebug's pipe bombs and grenade launchers be incendiary.

 

[BEEEEEES]

...and something else in general that affects all perks, but moreso the zerker:

Specimens will often just hurt you even though they appear to be stunned (and are not visibly attacking you at all) or in situations where they would be stunned/interrupted when taking damage before the patch came along and did away with that.

So a significant amount of time, it doesn't matter how skillfully you approach melee, because you get hurt by hurting the specimens: they plink you when you melee them or decapitate them, without any visible attack at all, instantly! That is a big part of the reason the 25% resist on zerkers doesn't mean diddly squat...

"I'm going to stab you repeatedly in the eye sockets."
"What?!?!? NOOOO!"
"Let's compromise then: what if I stab you 25% less repeatedly in the eye sockets?"
"...that's not really any better."
​

...coupled with the fact that backpedaling and environment (doorways) are pretty much your only forms of crowd control within the attack range you're supposed to be functioning at- melee.

 

[DocDave]

I don't feel that crowd control should enter the equation much for berserker, but his role at dealing with or countering boss type zeds needs to be brought to the forefront again one way or another.

 

[Double_Deagle]

...and something else in general that affects all perks, but moreso the zerker:

Specimens will often just hurt you even though they appear to be stunned (and are not visibly attacking you at all) or in situations where they would be stunned/interrupted when taking damage before the patch came along and did away with that.

So a significant amount of time, it doesn't matter how skillfully you approach melee, because you get hurt by hurting the specimens: they plink you when you melee them or decapitate them, without any visible attack at all, instantly! That is a big part of the reason the 25% resist on zerkers doesn't mean diddly squat...

"I'm going to stab you repeatedly in the eye sockets."
"What?!?!? NOOOO!"
"Let's compromise then: what if I stab you 25% less repeatedly in the eye sockets?"
"...that's not really any better."
​

...coupled with the fact that backpedaling and environment (doorways) are pretty much your only forms of crowd control within the attack range you're supposed to be functioning at- melee.

Umm, is it just me, or does the fact that stunned specimens can hit you sound like a bug?

 

[Nanostrike]

Umm, is it just me, or does the fact that stunned specimens can hit you sound like a bug?

I consider it one. And it hits, guess who, Berserker the hardest! D'OH!

 

[WarWithTostitos]

Of course sharpshooter players are going to say "WHATEVER WHY ARE YOU CRYING" because nothing can touch that class. Honestly. When you combine the damage bonus + the headshot bonus for their weapons, it becomes ridiculous. People give the SCAR crap for being an unbalanced weapon, but honestly the commando received the fewest boosts (next to the firebug) from level 5-6, and it does a maximum of +50% on any given shot. Sharpshooters have a base upgrade of +60% and then a further 50% damage boost on headshots. That's some seriously ridiculous damage.

IMO Tripwire will come out with a new difficulty level. After an update with a new level of perks, it's bound to happen. But to prevent that level (and suicidal still) from being played by nothing but sharpshooters, the perk needs a nerf. It needs to be re-thought out and re-tooled, because it can so easily kill everything. That, or Fleshpounds need a resistance to headshots. FP's are meant to be hulking scary dudes that require an entire team's attention, not "hey I'm calling this FP... headshot ok we're good". This was the same problem when people could spam its face with a bullpup before the update.
Or even - cap the headshot damage at 50% of a fleshpound's total hp. No decap, just half health. The crossbow has a long reload time and if it takes two separate shots, that requires either A) a LOT of skill to nail it perfectly, and/or B) cooperation between two sharpshooters (that's something, at least) or C) at the very least coopereration between the ss and the rest of the team.

One or both of those, IMO, would help the game a great deal.

 

[Voltali]

First I want to add that I am new to the KF forums, but I have been in other game forums before, but with so many people wanting the perks to change, I ask... Why???
Berzerker
With the Berzerker Perk, I have been hearing people complaining about the weapons, and the decap.

Commando
Compaints about the SARC and the level system have been poppin up, but they have been working on it and if you look at it from now and then, progression is way better.

Demolitionist
There is a few posts about this class, but it is the new class, no comments from me till it gets the "bugs" worked out.

Firbug
I have seen alot of people complaining about the one and only weapon the Firebug has. There is alot of solutions to the problem, but adding another flamethrower in the game isnt one of them.

Marksmen
The "all powerful" class atm. So far all I have heard is people complaining about how they should take away and not adjust the class to make it more viable to do other things besides use your pistol till the big guys come and use Xbow.

Medic
No complaints I can see about a medic. Glitch, but no complaints.

Support Sepcialist
Alot of people want the class nerfed, but to take you have to give, because not only will you be hurting the people who enjoy the support class just for being support, it will only be because they brought the Demo class to the game.

PLZ feel free to post any other threads of complaints here and solutions to the problems

I've never seen anyone ask for the Support to be nerfed...
Maybe you mean sharpshooter?

 

[mamoo]

I agree, the support may be able to clear groups with the AA12, but the ammo cap for that weapon is low enough to make this unviable.

 

[BEEEEEES]

I agree that the AA12 is fine. It's a real hoss in the hands of a Support Specialist, but the very limited ammo cap really balances it out.

 

[k_murdah]

• Stronger welder for Firebug that functions as a good melee tool.
• Fire axe easily usable for Firebug. (I actually like, but not a balance fix at all)
  
• Flaregun a la Team Fortress 2.
• Remake the Husk weapon into the next FB weapon.
• Incendiary bullets for FB per Left 4 Dead 2.
• An "upgrade" of flamethrower with more firepower/penetration/etc.
• Let the flamethrower shoot unignited liquid on the ground to light up later.
• Let the Firebug's pipe bombs and grenade launchers be incendiary.

Welder's not a bad idea, fireaxe funny but agreed not really a balance fix, flare gun's neat wouldn't mind it. Remaking the husk weapon's a pretty cool idea. Incendiary bullets not bad. Dunno about shooting unfired liquid makes the weapon more diverse but I'd have to get play time with it to see. Pipe bombs and grenade launchers sure might as well do rocket launchers but I always agreed to that idea until Demolitionists came out.

The only thing I don't really agree with is upgrading the flamethrower. I know coming out with ideas is hard but it is not the way to go. Tripwire tried it with the Bullpup, it was horrible. I vote against that as the solution.

Talking about the FP agreed make it take reduced HS damage or something to balance it out.

Besereker needs help, like option to dual wield or something I dunno. I thought Chainsaw was the mass crowd weapon but I normally don't play as Berserker so I wouldn't really know. Maybe make the option of using two weapons that do wider slashes than a single one or something.

SS I'm not hot on nerfing classes unless it's something silly like giving Support's welding buff to Firebug or something that's logical like the nade thing to Demos but I'm not a very good SS and I can play it better than anything but Commando right now, the FP thing is part of why. Dunno I mean the Husk adds a whole new element to the game but Perhaps rather than mess with the classes a whole lot or change known monsters a whole lot make a strong monster that A is strong against SS like uh..a headless monster? That's tough like the FP? And B weak against Berserker but strong against everything else. Oh and Firebug..so like really strong against bullets but weak to fire and melee?

I'd rather add to the game than keep trying to tweak it personally because trying to always balance existing stuff is never gonna work, look at MMORPGs.

 

[Anubis_FB]

I've never seen anyone ask for the Support to be nerfed...
Maybe you mean sharpshooter?

With Support, what I have read, is about the grenade ability, and the "mule" ability. Post have come up about the support vs demolitions using grenades and the LAW. I am sure now that I have explained my post, you kind of understand what I am talking about. For some strange reason, the LAW rockets get benifets the same way the support get grenades, so the support can carry more rockets then any other class. Now with the Demolition class, (I dont think they get addtional grenades like the support) but people would like the ability to use the LAW, (and I agree) to go to the Demo. That also means the ability to carry the grenades. Like I said in my post tho, when you take something away, you need to give something back. Otherwise you will be hurting the class further (and the people who play it), just for introducing a new class