Increase the Limit of Simultaneous Enemies

[Templarion]

More enemies should appear at the same time. The number of enemies should scale with the number of players and the size of map, of course. In the outdoor maps (like the farm map) you are actually searching for the zombies! What kind of horror is that?!

There should always be too many of them. They should come from every direction, banging every door and windows. They should outnumber the players easily. At the moment people are competing with kills. Who is going to level his perk faster and who is going to get the most kills? This happens basicly because there are so few enemies at the same time in the map.

In the 6 player games 32 mutants (if I have understood correctly it is the max number of simultaneous enemies) makes only about 5 mutants per player. What? Only 5? It should be 50 per player! At least 50...

PS. I understand this kind of change would have an impact on performance but something must be done.

 

[Sgt Jigglebelly]

if you play around with this in sandbox mode i think you'll see that 50 specimens per player at one time on the map, even with just 2 people, just simply isn't do-able... (try it lol). with just 2 people, that's 100 specs on the map at once, and with 6, that's a whopping 300 specs on the map at one time! i've messed around in sandbox with 200 spawned clots at once, and i can garuntee you that it's a slideshow long before you reach that max of 200, and that's not even with them ALL actually in view

that being said, i still agree, the difficulty increases normal --> hard --> suicidal should have come with increases in the number of specimens that can exist on the map at once - ESPECIALLY on a map like Farm. 32 is the max all the time, and across all difficulties, as it is right now, but I'd think something like 50 for suicidal is certainly do-able

or maybe just:

normal --> 32
hard --> 40
suicidal --> 48 or 50

i'd love to see that added as a default that is compatible with perks in the future. but we can't complain too much because the sandbox mode gives us a ton of freedom with stuff, just without the possible perk progression

 

[Skunkee]

Your suggestion would make the server lag ridiculously strenuous on all but the beefiest of systems. I agree that there should be more, but 50 per person is a bit much. Maybe in suicidal mode have higher spawn ratios?

 

[Templarion]

Sgt Jigglebelly, sandbox mode is failure. For some reason, people don't like to play if they can't level up their perks. No perks, no game. Good idea, though. I give it a try someday.

Skunkee, hard to believe that it wasn't possible. In Battlefield there are 64 player games. In ARMA 2 there are 124 player games. I know that those games have different game engines but still... Some extra enemies can't be so hard to add. At least, they should increase the limit as much as possible. The game is just ridiculous with so few enemies.

PS. After all, there are servers that support 40 players in KF, too.

 

[omarfw]

a zombie master amount of clots is what i'm looking for. that's what i always loved about zombie master. the sheer amounts of zombies and the lack of lag.

 

[Nanostrike]

a zombie master amount of clots is what i'm looking for. that's what i always loved about zombie master. the sheer amounts of zombies and the lack of lag.

Yeah, but even they don't have 300 zombies vs 6 players simultaneously. It's more like 100 or so vs 5 or 6, which is doable, seeing as how their zombies seem to take fewer system resources.

I think It should increase the 'specimens at a time' limit by 10 per difficulty level above normal.

32 - Normal
42 - Hard
52 - Suicidal

Given, it would make Suicidal near-impossible. Those specimens already have a crapton of HP each...

 

[omarfw]

obviously (if it were possible) if the amount of zombies went up, the health of each one would have to be lowered.

 

[Templarion]

obviously (if it were possible) if the amount of zombies went up, the health of each one would have to be lowered.

Exactly!

Don't scale hitpoints or armor values. Scale the number of enemies. Living flesh is always vulnerable and easy to destroy. The advantage of zombies is always the huge numbers!

 

[omarfw]

if a zombie apocalypse happens and there's only like, 15 zombies. well that's not much of an apocalypse is it.

 

[GeneticArmor]

or maybe just:
normal --> 32
hard --> 40
suicidal --> 48 or 50

Sounds sweet

 

[Skunkee]

obviously (if it were possible) if the amount of zombies went up, the health of each one would have to be lowered.

Now that I can agree with. It would probably reduce server lag a little bit if there were large numbers of zombies but they all had similar health values and whatnot (and approached you from all angles rather than mindlessly follow you in circles). If they had lower health, they'd be dying and disappearing at a faster rate which could reduce some stress on the server side of things.

I wouldn't be too opposed to that idea if I saw it in action a few times.

 

[Oldih]

Jigglebelly is pretty much righ about the sandbox thing. Up to 50 specimen it works ok, somewhat, but when you have over 70+ active specimen simutanously, they don't have to be even in your line of sight to lag the game.

I remember once trying 320 simutaneous clots at once. I saw about 100 of them in my field of view and atleast 150+ were roaming off from my line of sight and it took six seconds to react to anything. FPS was practically 0 and it consisted of 'warping' once between six seconds around the area.

One attempt to have 200+ active enemies on suicidal resulted a listen server crash after several minutes. Same on dedicated caused people to drop out typically after some point, or have quite major lag.

So as for the idea itself, minor increase in enemies could work, but +50 per player would pretty much FUBAR it.

Oh, and with four players and some fun with sandbox mode, 600 active specimen caused the [dedicated] server to crash after about 3\4 of them spawned.

 

[Nanostrike]

Jigglebelly is pretty much righ about the sandbox thing. Up to 50 specimen it works ok, somewhat, but when you have over 70+ active specimen simutanously, they don't have to be even in your line of sight to lag the game.

I remember once trying 320 simutaneous clots at once. I saw about 100 of them in my field of view and atleast 150+ were roaming off from my line of sight and it took six seconds to react to anything. FPS was practically 0 and it consisted of 'warping' once between six seconds around the area.

One attempt to have 200+ active enemies on suicidal resulted a listen server crash after several minutes. Same on dedicated caused people to drop out typically after some point, or have quite major lag.

So as for the idea itself, minor increase in enemies could work, but +50 per player would pretty much FUBAR it.

Oh, and with four players and some fun with sandbox mode, 600 active specimen caused the [dedicated] server to crash after about 3\4 of them spawned.

More than about 70 specimens, period, is beyond unplayable. 50 is pretty much the max that was workable for me in Sandbox...

 

[Oldih]

More than about 70 specimens, period, is beyond unplayable. 50 is pretty much the max that was workable for me in Sandbox...

I managed to pull off 100 active with 'reasonable' FPS taht you were atleast able to move and aim, even though it was horribly choppy.

Nevertheless, point has been served.

 

[Slappy Cromwell]

I don't mean to sound uncivil, but it seems like you guys need some better computers:


This happened to be funny as hell. The server's maximum zombie count was set to 1000, I believe.

But yeah, the maximum zombie count should scale to a reasonable amount in proportion to the current number of players. It's a little unfair that two players have to face off against the same simultaneous number of specimens as six.

 

[omarfw]

i'd be happy with even a minor increase honestly. i just dont think there should ever be a a time when i DONT see specimens

 

[Templarion]

i'd be happy with even a minor increase honestly. i just dont think there should ever be a a time when i DONT see specimens

And unfortunately there is a lot of time when I don't see specimens when I play with my friends... (they are too good for me)

 

[mastertheknife]

You can change that value yourself, for example to set it to 64:
set KFMod.KFGameType MaxZombiesOnce 64
Although from my testing, the change will only take effect next wave.

In our server we have a script that calculates the value from the amount of players connected (excluding spectators), Players * 4 with a bottom limit of 32. When the server is full, the value is 96. I hardly notice any lag, it depends on the server's hardware and player's hardware.

 

[Templarion]

You can change that value yourself, for example to set it to 64:
set KFMod.KFGameType MaxZombiesOnce 64
Although from my testing, the change will only take effect next wave.

In our server we have a script that calculates the value from the amount of players connected (excluding spectators), Players * 4 with a bottom limit of 32. When the server is full, the value is 96. I hardly notice any lag, it depends on the server's hardware and player's hardware.

Thank you! I must test this today.

I tested it before but since the first wave does not affect on it I thought it has no effect at all.

I just don't undestand why things that make game harder cannot be adjusted through normal server settings and without MacGyver tricks.

 

[Oldih]

I don't mean to sound uncivil, but it seems like you guys need some better computers:

I am aware that my computer is not the greatest powerhouse there, but even one RO custom map with tons of trees and large enough that it takes 15min+ to do one lap around with a vehicle works beter on 50 player server than KF with 80+ active specimen