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Call of Duty 5

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#521
DraKon2k said:
Multiplayer *skip*So I would indeed go as far as saying that the core gameplay is still the same, just that CoD5 kinda expanded in that direction with adding the ranking system etc.
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Again, because appearantly it still didn't get through: I wasn't talking about the gameplay!

DraKon2k said:
Also I don't see how you're always talking about 'people are turned off', sure some are no doubt but in the end there'll still be one of the biggest player bases without any doubt
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The people who are turned off posted in this thread but you shook off their opinion as worthless with your "it's fun and others like it so shut up" attitude. Rak even went as far as to deny their point claiming that the game was still as much of a ww2 experience as the old games were. It is not. It should be evident from the screenshots in this thread alone that it isn't. You may not care. You may be in for the gameplay which is still as good as ever but please, you can't deny that this game offers less ww2 atmosphere than the old ones.
The people that care may or may not be a majority but they exist. In this forum they exist in a higher density than in most places anyway. But the fact of the matter is that there are people who are turned off by that new direction.
Don't pick on them claiming that there is no new direction just because you don't care about it.

DraKon2k said:
And tbh. Call of Duty 4 very well showed how serious you have to take such a game, having sold over ten million copies.
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So? Serious Sam and Duke Nukem sold a lot for their age too (those were different times) but I don't think the games wanted to be taken seriously.
I wasn't talking about CoD5 not being a force to be reconed with on the gaming market. I said they kind of undermine their own authority as a war-game by adding fun-modes. The old games were serious games and even if they were not realistic per se they were immersive and people believed what was in them! Remember how many suggestions we got for Russians to not be armed in Stalingrad maps because of CoD1's Stalingrad stage and Enemy at the Gates? Or that ncos should have the ability to shoot people who retreat a few meters? The game and the movie conveyed that they were realistic and based on true events, even if they were not.
A zombie mode doesn't completely ruin this, obviously, but it scratches on it. If it had been left to the community to produce the nonsense-gamemodes the game could keep up it's authority (for the lack of a better word) and the few people who actually want that would still be able to play their zombie mode because the community would make one anyway.


I just don't like that rigorous stance of denial that was adopted by some people in here and that's why I responded.
Look at this exaggerated rendition of the current discussion (don't if you aren't in the mood for a joke. I'd hate to see you quote this...):
- Nah, I'm not the mood. I don't like the bunny suit, darling.
- There is no bunny suit.
- What are you talking about, you are wearing it right now?
- Huh? No, I'm not. I'm not a 9 incher and I never was. I'm still the same as ever, if you don't like me, leave!
- Honey, you are fine. I love you, I just hate your bunny suit.
- There is no bunny suit. I left the ***-cheeks and my nipples open. Touch me there and ignore the suit. It's just something additional that you or your friends would have wanted me to wear some day anyway. Every ex I had did.
- Darling, I'd love to ignore it but the suit turns me off. Can't you understand that?
- Yeah, go screw a mule for christ's sakes, if I'm not enough for you. There is no bunny suit btw.
 
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#522
Murphy said:
Why the "it's fun so shut up" attitude?
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Because it's a fact that a game which is no fun at all does not sell. If it has some kind of funfactor, it is ought to sell more or less. Especially if the title is well known.

Can be compared to how some products are advertised with happiness with all the smiling persons and such on the package. Buy product X, you'll become happy!

And regarding of your CoD Stalingrad map and EatG comment, you just stole my words. Good point nevertheless.
 
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#523
The point you obviously don't get Murphy, is, that CoD5s MP simply isn't designed to be all realistic ww2 atmosphere style. I could very well imagine it to be like that in hardcore mode(still not arma simulation level but hardly anybody would want that anyways), but the main MP is designed to be fun and that's it.

In previous ww2-based Call of Duties the ww2 atmosphere pretty much always came from the top notch maps, tbh. after BiA i think they were most realistic looking western front maps. Now guess what, you didn't play it yet in MP but probably only saw crappy GT-videos and compareable vids(obviously they always show off more 'action' in those videos plus the player often being a noob), if you look at beta gameplay modes on rather larger maps it's totally different.

And how you're talking about 'visual realism' is good and nice but you can't seriously tell me that atmosphere=visual realism. If you have top notch weapon models which are perfectly realistically modelled yet it takes 20 rounds to kill someone how does that make better atmosphere? If the gameplay ain't right your 'visual realism' won't change much either.

And about ppl on this forum. Do you honestly think anybody in this thread except for very few persons ever played any CoD(2 or 4) for a long period like at least a year? Most people just come here to be an elitist prick and bash the game eventhough they're never going to play it anyways.
 
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#524
DraKon2k said:
The point you obviously don't get Murphy, is, that CoD5s MP simply isn't designed to be all realistic ww2 atmosphere style.
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Finally. The first step is done. Now wrap your head around the concept that there might be people who dislike it for that and you are there, because that's all they are saying.:)

DraKon2k said:
And how you're talking about 'visual realism' is good and nice but you can't seriously tell me that atmosphere=visual realism. If you have top notch weapon models which are perfectly realistically modelled yet it takes 20 rounds to kill someone how does that make better atmosphere?
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Only if you are looking for realistic gameplay or if you know realistic gameplay when you see it. The objectives in the CoD4 demo, for example, are so nonsensical it hurts but no one cares because most people simply didn't know any better. ArmA's objectives were mostly nonsensical crap too but its target audience did call them on that because they knew it was wrong and they cared.
CoD isn't a war game though. It's a war-movie-game, so to speak. If you want a war-movie like atmosphere then excessive amount of bad-guys to waste and having to spray more bullets than should be necessary can even add to the feeling as long as the set pieces and props look authentic. Getting shot out of nowhere from some bad guy 400m away from you in a bush would even be detrimental to a solid war-movie atmosphere. That's what the old CoD games were all about and I assume the singleplayer of CoD5 is going to be similar.
MP through over board the authentic props though and to some that's enough of a turn-off. Because now it doesn't even offer war-movie atmosphere anymore (to those who can spot the anachronisms, and to be honest they aren't just minor slip-ups).

DraKon2k said:
And about ppl on this forum. Do you honestly think anybody in this thread except for very few persons ever played any CoD(2 or 4) for a long period like at least a year? Most people just come here to be an elitist prick and bash the game
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That's your perception because everyone who criticises the game for offering too little atmosphere/realism for their tastes is an elitist realism nut in your eyes whose opinion is nothing but zealous realism fanatism.
In their eyes you are a blind fanboy who defends every game down to a borderline irrational level of fanboyism even if it isn't out yet and has (to their eyes) obvious flaws.

I would guess that the statements made in a discussion are seen at least twice as extreme by the respective other party just because of the prejudiced image of each-other.

If you honestly say, "hey, this and that ain't so bad and who cares if the rest of the game is fun", that's a rational statement. Due to your image it is percieved as "I love this game, like I love every game, don't you criticise it you nut!"
Conversly if I, as a temporary representative of the realism crowd of which I am not a member, say "was it really necessary to mirror the guns in Far Cry 2? Some people dislike that because it simply looks wrong and those who don't care probably aren't overflowing with joy just because they get brass in their faces" that's a rational statement too but it is percieved as "OMG, this is unrealistic, I want this game to be a war-simulator!".

Responses aren't made to the actual statements but to the percieved statements. In the second example a possible response could be "this was never meant to be a war-simulator". Counter response: "I never said that. I said..." and from then on it's all about nitpicking and quote-massacering the other party's posts for bits and pieces that support the view that they indeed made a statement as extreme as it was percieved, or worse it becomes personal.

To answer your question: There were lots of people in here that say they enjoyed Call of Duty 1 and most seem to agree that United Offensive was even better.
Myself I prefer CoD2's multiplayer over the others but I didn't like the singleplayer much. I actually even finished the dreaded CoD3 on the original xbox. The best thing about it were the hilarious accents and the predictability of the sub-plots but I got an honest kick out of some of the missions too.
 
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#525
Murphy said:
MP through over board the authentic props though and to some that's enough of a turn-off. Because now it doesn't even offer war-movie atmosphere anymore (to those who can spot the anachronisms, and to be honest they aren't just minor slip-ups).
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Again, I'd really advice you of not judging a game by the few retarded GT-movies you might've seen.

Murphy said:
That's your perception because everyone who criticises the game for offering too little atmosphere...
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That's exactly the point. Those who don't condemn everything to suck hard or in this case I'll speak of myself I always try to give any game a fair chance. Now there's a big difference between giving a game a fair chance and looking at the positives(and I am very well also noticing negative things) and bashing the game for simply the sake of bashing it. And this is a fact. You just have to look at all the comments in here, most of them are 'wow this sucks' and even more respectless comments. I do accept other opinions but not if it's just random idiots not being able to articulate themselves and instead going all 'WOW THIS SUCKS'. Because while we might often not share the same view in terms of games or even beyond that, debating with you always is on a pretty high niveau, as opposed to some other people.
Murphy said:
To answer your question: There were lots of people in here that say they enjoyed Call of Duty 1 and most seem to agree that United Offensive was even better.
Myself I prefer CoD2's multiplayer over the others but I didn't like the singleplayer much. I actually even finished the dreaded CoD3 on the original xbox. The best thing about it were the hilarious accents and the predictability of the sub-plots but I got an honest kick out of some of the missions too.
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Call of Duty 1 was released 5 years ago and like I said in my previous post I'm talking about cod2 and cod4 as previous cods. I loved DoD1.3 and previous versions too and in the first moment I pretty much hated DoD:S, but when I gave it a fair chance and had fun and a very good time. Of course it would be awesome if DoD:S was more like 1.3 but that's the point: World doesn't hold on.

And in the end you can't please everyone and if you were a game producer and could either make a fun MP that 95% of your players will like or a hardcore realism MP which is loved by the 5% but everybody else hates it, you would no doubt make the same choice, because you might not forget that the game needs to sell and the people behind that games might just have lives and even families they need to keep going. Also those 5% are the reason why Hardcore mode exists.
 
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#526
DraKon2k said:
And in the end you can't please everyone and if you were a game producer and could either make a fun MP that 95% of your players will like or a hardcore realism MP which is loved by the 5% but everybody else hates it
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Based on that logic, next TWI game has to be something greatly "arcadish" compared to RO since otherwise they can't profit well enough by making a game for a minority.

Again, I'd really advice you of not judging a game by the few retarded GT-movies you might've seen.
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First impression sure causes trouble, doesn't they? I have no idea if final version (aka retail) of CoD5 will be great or not, but when the first thing you see about a game is just retarded AD\HD heaven it doesn't take a genius to figure out that the first impression is not exactly too good. Once the reputation is up, it's nearly impossible to get rid of or to do something about it. Kinda like italians and WW2.
 
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#527
Oldih said:
Based on that logic, next TWI game has to be something greatly "arcadish" compared to RO since otherwise they can't profit well enough by making a game for a minority.
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I didn't say that realism games don't sell. Red Orchestra had already had a very strong community beforehand + Steam advertising factor + PC only so they obviously sold quite many copies. My point was just that the COD community never was a (hardcore) realism community and that the potential of the average gamer is definitely bigger, especcially in terms of COD.
 
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#528
So I just played the MP-Demo(I didn't actually play it, I didn't even spawn because my connection was interrupted somehow) and saw a nade exploding right next to the foot of an american soldier. Lol it kinda blew away his foot(not his whole leg though like in biahh) and it looked really aweful because the bone was kinda still there :/ In fact even the 'standard' shot impact wounds looked pretty gruesome compared to other games. But I like it, it kinda shows that they're trying new stuff as well because it's the first game featuring real gore with blowing off limbs etc.

However since I first off always got and error when trying to start the beta + connection interrupted before I spawned I'll take that as a sign not to play it till full game release :p So I'll wait.
 
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#531
Yeh its terrible! I thought 'true servers' meant hardcore. But you're stuck with x-hairs in all modes...

The dogs are a total joke! The entire map is just filled with dogs barking ALL THE ****ING TIME!!!!!!!!

Plus Ive tried to update PB but im still getting kicked. Have to play on none PB servers but the game is too sucky to keep playing anyways so uninstalled!

If I want COD4, I'l play COD4 thank you very much!
 
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#533
D3terioNation said:
Yeh its terrible! I thought 'true servers' meant hardcore. But you're stuck with x-hairs in all modes...

The dogs are a total joke! The entire map is just filled with dogs barking ALL THE ****ING TIME!!!!!!!!

Plus Ive tried to update PB but im still getting kicked. Have to play on none PB servers but the game is too sucky to keep playing anyways so uninstalled!

If I want COD4, I'l play COD4 thank you very much!
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Don't say we didn't warn you mate ;)
 
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#537
Yeah, to be honest CoD5 looks like a CoD4 mod, some of the perks and challenges are renamed but it is basically new player models and weapons. Problem is whilst CoD4 was great some of the features don't work too well in WWII, like apature sights on Thompsons and silencers on rifles. Still pretty addictive though, maybe a good realism mod will come out for it. :)
 
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