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Tank Killing Question

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Grammostola

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Jan 2, 2007
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#1
I was playing today on the German side and I was faced with a situation that I found quite odd really. I was using Panzers and Panthers to confront the Russian tanks. I am unsure what model they were. Anyway...I was faced with a Russian tank that I was able to fire on and hit 5 times as he was occupied with someone else. He finally turned on me and fired killing me with a single hit. I re-spawned and went back to get him. 2 more hits on him and a single shot from him killed me. Again I re-spawned and went back. One hit on him and one hit from him killed me. This happened one more time before I gave up on him in that game. Count that...9 hits from me on one tank and he was able to kill me 4 times with 4 shots. On the other hand, I was able to kill bot driven tanks with one or 2 shots and before you say...yes, I was using AP shells. In the second game, it was a very similar situation with me firing and hitting the same guy many times and him killing me (and other tanks) with one hit.
Am I missing something here? Is it possible it could cake 9 hits and still survive? What is the area on a Russian tank I should be aiming for? And why are the almighty German tanks able to be shot down with one hit?
 
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#2
Every tank in game is possible to be killed with one shot to the proper location with the right ammo at the right range and at the right angle.

You'll find pritable "cards" in the media section of our webpage showing diagrams of each tank with descriptions of armor and locations of critical hit points, such as ammo supply.

No, the "impervious" german army isn't as impervious as many would like you to believe. Yes, the system we have in place is not perfect or as extensive as we would like it to be. Yes sometimes an odd shot will get through when it shouldn't. This aside, the data we use for our tank system is very well researched, and parts of it are not in "public" hands.

The "down side" of our tank system if you will, is we balance our maps with what tanks is available to each side. We do so because in a game enviornment (at least in RO's) it is not possible to create force of tanks on one side that is clearly supperior to the other sides (ie: 12 tigers on the german side to 12 t34/76's on the russian).
 
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#5
Yoshiro said:
Every tank in game is possible to be killed with one shot to the proper location with the right ammo at the right range and at the right angle.
Click to expand...

But 9 hits on him? Mind you, I am not complaining but rather, I am trying to understand.
Where do I learn these proper locations to hit a tank?

always angle your tank
Click to expand...

Yes, I realize I made the mistake 2 times by going head-on against him but twice I did angle the tank and it made no difference.
 
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#7
The penetration is based way too much on angling. You could shoot from 50 meters against an angled IS2 with a Tiger for an eternity, but it just won't penetrate. If you had shot 9 HE shells at that tank, it would have probably been destroyed. The tank armour penetration is buggy and unrealistic, but hopefully they will fix it.

And critical hit areas like the ammo and fuel are bull****, hopefully they will be removed too. Just having a shell penetrate the tank should be enough to seriously hurt the crew.

In maps like Arad the angling is not a complete game breaker, but in smaller maps like Konigsplatz it can seriously ruin the immersion as enemy AT infantry stops all attempts at manuevering to a better shooting position. The tank warfare should be more based on spotting and less on tanks that are paper without angling.
 
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#8
Generally, never try to outshoot an angled Russian tank. Always try to flank them. For reasons which I will not mention here* the tactics employed by the Russians in the actual war must be used by the Germans in RO. German tanks must assault and outflank the Russian tanks simply because Russian tanks can angle, sit back, and destroy German tanks essentially at their leisure. All Russian tanks have hideously effective armor and their guns are second to none.

I shudder to think of what it would be like if one of the 100mm-gun Russian tanks were implemented in-game. Given the performance of what should be a throwaway SPG (the SU-76), one of the SPGs that actually stood a chance in the war would probably be invincible in-game.

I highly doubt any high-quality German SPG such as the Nashorn (the one which was reported to kill an IS-2 from a range of 4600 meters) would even hold a candle to the SU-100 if it was as overmodelled as the Russian tanks are.

*buggy and horridly unrealistic damage system
 
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#11
Crim said:
LOL!!!!
Click to expand...

Reported by whom? I would be more than happy to just continue this thread as insult-fest, but if you want to raise it to academic and scientific levels, be my guest, and start by citing your sources? Not some website with "it is reported" gossip - hard, peer reviewed historical sources.

Also, speaking from the scientific standpoint - do you know what is the energy from a Nashorn gun at THAT insanely huge distance? Do you know how thick is the IS-2 armor?

Get the numbers, learn some high school physics and do the math.

After you do the math, ask yourself what are the chances of EVEN IDENTIFYING a tank - let alone friend or foe, and LET ALONE the exact type - at that distance. Oh, did the guy get the tactical number on the tank's turret? :p

If that's of any consolation to you German fanboi, I am sure Soviets have even more ridicolous claims somewhere in their books, memoirs, websites....... but that's beside the point.
 
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#17
Since you've apparently taken this quite seriously, please note that I said it was reported to have done that. I'm not going to bother finding "hard, peer reviewed historical sources" for a singular event involving an anti-tank unit on the Eastern front; a subject which is not exactly covered in depth when reading about the Wermacht.

I simply know that the unit (sPzJagAbt 88) was with the 17 Armee near Marzdorf in March of 1945, which was when this was reported to have taken place, and that it was comprised of Nashorns.

I also believe, based on rather simple and most likely incorrect proportions, that a PaK 43 cannon firing PzGr 40/43 might be able to penetrate approximately 70-90mm of armor at that distance at 30 degrees from the horizontal. Now, at that distance, the ballistic path taken by the shell may well arc it sufficiently to give it a near-90 degree angle of attack on the IS-2's angled armor.

Now, the IS-2, of course, has 120mm of angled armor on the front. It is also possible that the armor itself was weakened due to faulty casting, something which was not unheard of for the IS-2 tank.

I would hesitate to call such an event impossible.

Sure, a shot at 4600 meters would be more luck than skill. I am not sure of the quality of the optics on the Nashorn, and what the circumstances were if it ever actually happened.

I'm not saying it DID actually happen. I'm simply saying that it was REPORTED to have happened. There is, of course, a difference. I'm not going to debate how possible it was or wasn't, or get all angry when you call me a nazi fanboi because I think Russian tanks are overmodeled in RO.

I'm simply going to say that it was reported to have happened, and was certainly within the realm of possibility. Anything is possible, after all, and I would hesitate to doubt the penetration power of the shell on the far right.

tankgerim4.jpg


edit:
Oleg said:
more likely just a picture of Nashorn, killing an IS-2 from another continent.....
Click to expand...

I wish.

Another edit: Wow. I spent way too much time reading things that were comprised mainly of numbers when researching for this reply. For example:

On 15th July the s.H.Pz.Jg.Abt. 88 was with the XXXXVIII. Pz.Korps near Brody, where it stayed with H.Gr. Ukraine (later H.Gr.A) until the end of 1944. During the Soviet Winter Offensive in January 1945, the s.H.Pz.Jg.Abt. 88 supported the Pz.Reg. 21 near Preiswitz, Silesia. Reportedly, the s.H.Pz.Jg.Abt. 88 tested some I.R. night vision equipment near Katowice (Kattowitz), during this time. In March, the s.H.Pz.Jg.Abt. 88 was with the 17. Armee near Marzdorf, and in April 1945 it was attached to the VIII. Armee Korps (17. Armee).
Click to expand...
Researching anti-tank units on the Eastern front is SO MUCH FUN!!!!!1
 
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#18
it is shocking, but true that the germans tankers in game are doomed to use the tactics of allied tankers in real life.
taking on russian tanks from long range is pure suicide angled or not, your only chance is to flood them, and the slow panzers are not suited for this.
the ruskies got it all: firepower, armor, speed
i know this is for balance reasons, but its just the same but upside down
they took 2 advantages away from germans: firepower, armor
and gave 2 advantages to allies: firepower, armor

like the panzer IV, the only other tank on arad it stands a chance to, is the unicarrier
 
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#19
SchutzeSepp said:
i know this is for balance reasons, but its just the same but upside down
they took 2 advantages away from germans: firepower, armor
and gave 2 advantages to allies: firepower, armor
Click to expand...

No they took the biggest Russian advantage - THE NUMBERS, and in more then one case, gave it to Germans (thru team stacking :D ).

I've said it many times - I'd love for Germans to get every toy from their arsenal, no matter how overpowered, if only scenario would force at least 2:1 advantage for Ruskies in, well, pretty much everything.
 
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#20
Crim said:
Since you've apparently taken this quite seriously, please note that I said it was reported to have done that. I'm not going to bother finding "hard, peer reviewed historical sources" for a singular event involving an anti-tank unit on the Eastern front; a subject which is not exactly covered in depth when reading about the Wermacht.
Click to expand...

It "has been reported" (by the Japanese) that they sunk 7 US fleet carriers in what has since been known as Great Marianas Turkey shoot (I think they didn't sink a single US ship - let alone fleet carrier - and lost several of their own).

7 or 8 more CVs were "sunk" in the battle for Phillipines etc etc.

Somehow, whole world laughs at outwoldly WW2 claims by:

- Japanese
- Russians
- Italians
- even Americans sometimes

pretty much in that order.... yet, there is no German claim, however outlandish it might be, from "almost bombing New York" to flight to Manchuria, to Nashorns shooting 4600 meters, to Alien Nazi bases on Antarctica, that would not find at least a bunch of followers :eek:

Whatever - I'd agree with any German toy or improvement, if Russians would be given their biggest historical advantage in war - NUMBERS.
 
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