Tactics Tactics for armchair Commanders
- Thread starter Colt .45 killer
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NANO has an infantry only server? bummer.
Armor only and infantry only servers split the community.
Armor only and infantry only servers split the community.
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Who can I follow?
Who can I follow?
How about a list of places to go to actually FIND this style of play?
I've only owned RO for about 4 days now.
Being from a "tactical" CoD:UO clan, I understand the importance of TEAMWORK and feel as though I've FINALLY found a game that rewards it inherently without having to mod the hell out the server.
Here's my issue:
Regardless of the fact that I am a clan leader, I am COMPLETELY WILLING TO FOLLOW anyone competent in a good round of RO, because I'm a noob.
I got this game because of everything I've read about it, but I just can't seem to find a server where the things described in this thread actually come true.
One server I was on, featured one of it's clan members camped just outside and around the corner of my spawn exit, and he proceeded to make me his b*****!
Fine, I'm new, couldn't get out, but WORSE, it seemed that my team was made up of a gang of "lone rangers" who thought this was the single player practice mode. It took everything I had NOT to take the commander's position.
On another server it got even worse, and I DID take the commander's position, even though I'm new and haven't earned it yet.
CAN ANYONE point me in the direction of a server where it's clan members are NOT idiots, and where teamplay and communication are often notably employed?
Who can I follow?
How about a list of places to go to actually FIND this style of play?
I've only owned RO for about 4 days now.
Being from a "tactical" CoD:UO clan, I understand the importance of TEAMWORK and feel as though I've FINALLY found a game that rewards it inherently without having to mod the hell out the server.
Here's my issue:
Regardless of the fact that I am a clan leader, I am COMPLETELY WILLING TO FOLLOW anyone competent in a good round of RO, because I'm a noob.
I got this game because of everything I've read about it, but I just can't seem to find a server where the things described in this thread actually come true.
One server I was on, featured one of it's clan members camped just outside and around the corner of my spawn exit, and he proceeded to make me his b*****!
Fine, I'm new, couldn't get out, but WORSE, it seemed that my team was made up of a gang of "lone rangers" who thought this was the single player practice mode. It took everything I had NOT to take the commander's position.
On another server it got even worse, and I DID take the commander's position, even though I'm new and haven't earned it yet.
CAN ANYONE point me in the direction of a server where it's clan members are NOT idiots, and where teamplay and communication are often notably employed?
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P.S.: Of the three or four public servers that I HAVE visited, I've only heard ONE voice on VOIP, and he was saying "SORRY, MAN...OH MAN, I'M SO SORRY" after having tk'ed a buddy.
Otherwise....silence...I had been wondering if my headphones were broken until I heard that.
Otherwise....silence...I had been wondering if my headphones were broken until I heard that.
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My note: you are as good comander as good is your team. You can be Napoleon and loose every war with players without map&game knowledge. You must have teoretic tactic that everybody follows set before match even start. Main commander's work is realtime reacting to actual situation on field. In other words, if everything goes perfect than no commender is needed, becasue everybody knows what to do. The main power of good commander is to take right decission when situation is not going as team would like to.
Ie decide when it is useless to try get back lost position and better is to settle good defence that will delay incomming attacks.
Few points:
-nobody is "natural born commander" when firstly started doing it
-make sure that your team knows what to do before match starts
-make sure your decision will be accepted by team even in case other do not agree during match (imo extremly important) - you can analyse your decision AFTER match not during. There is no time for discussion during war. - Our clan rule: "democracy before and after match, imperative during match"
-doing commander = multitasking - you must have idea of overall game situation, you have to explain your team what to do when necessary and still perform good play (so you will not be weak point of team) this all sometimes in very "hot" moments...
-let other memebers of your team try how is it being commander in war - thats also important because a lot of time players do not have even a little idea how difficult this can be and very often they think that it is some privilage to do it... looks like that but it is not like that imo.
-do not be afraid to apologize for wrong decission to your team - even leader has to improove his skill by doing mistakes... and it is often trend to put responsibility for bad result on leader
-...and many common "rules" how to lead group of people...
Ie decide when it is useless to try get back lost position and better is to settle good defence that will delay incomming attacks.
Few points:
-nobody is "natural born commander" when firstly started doing it
-make sure that your team knows what to do before match starts
-make sure your decision will be accepted by team even in case other do not agree during match (imo extremly important) - you can analyse your decision AFTER match not during. There is no time for discussion during war. - Our clan rule: "democracy before and after match, imperative during match"
-doing commander = multitasking - you must have idea of overall game situation, you have to explain your team what to do when necessary and still perform good play (so you will not be weak point of team) this all sometimes in very "hot" moments...
-let other memebers of your team try how is it being commander in war - thats also important because a lot of time players do not have even a little idea how difficult this can be and very often they think that it is some privilage to do it... looks like that but it is not like that imo.
-do not be afraid to apologize for wrong decission to your team - even leader has to improove his skill by doing mistakes... and it is often trend to put responsibility for bad result on leader
-...and many common "rules" how to lead group of people...
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To be honest, I think what has happened is the community used to be pretty small here, and made up of players who pushed teamwork pretty hard. Once they had the free trial, a lot of new guys showed up from other gaming communities. This watered down the teamwork factor on the servers.
Granted, even before the trial there were lots of times where players went off by themselves and refused to work together.
Frankly, RO isn't that different from other FPS games in the teamwork department. There's nothing about RO that enforces or encourages teamwork over games like DoD, CoD, BF2, etc... It's up to the community to ecourage teamwork. I have yet to play ANY game (and this includes the MMOG games like Aces High and WWIIOL) where teamwork is the norm. Players just want to have "fun" and that rarely means following someone else's orders. The ugly truth is that if you want to use teamwork and tactics, you have to join a squad/clan. That is the ONLY way that you will find players who are willing to cooperate with you on a regular basis.
The best you can get on a pub server is to simply follow another player around. At least then you're working together (even though he probably doesn't know or care).
Every once in a while, you'll accidentally get enough teamwork minded players together on a pub server to get some good tactics going. But frankly, that hasn't happened to me in a couple of months.
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Thanks for your honesty Ram...
I guess REDSQUAD is just going to have to start hosting a RO server.
I guess REDSQUAD is just going to have to start hosting a RO server.
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WW2 online is less teamwork and more lemming/herd effect. I remember one situation in particular no one said a word we just ran from house to house along a street. There were probably 100 of us and we were pinned down by tanks so we had to stick together, it was quite the sight! Out of the 100 some people probably 20 survived 
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well most people are willing to listen to a commander, voip is the missing link. with it most of those lone rangers are willing to lone range in the ordered direction, an when you have 9 lone rangers attacking the same place together, there is teamwork.
ive heard the argument that if everybody knows what to do a commander is not neededbefore. its crap, everyone can be a lone wolf, and know what to do, but if they are all doing the right thing but not together then they are worthless. a team commander brings them together to achieve teamwork.
one thing im going to add to the original post, is this:
a team commander should go over in light detail the entire plan for the map AT THE BEGINNING of the round. this way the team has a general idea of whats next, and can try and put themselves in a better position to complete those objectives when the time comes, or sappers can go an pop stuff open early knowing that soon there are going to be people walking through those doors.
ive heard the argument that if everybody knows what to do a commander is not neededbefore. its crap, everyone can be a lone wolf, and know what to do, but if they are all doing the right thing but not together then they are worthless. a team commander brings them together to achieve teamwork.
one thing im going to add to the original post, is this:
a team commander should go over in light detail the entire plan for the map AT THE BEGINNING of the round. this way the team has a general idea of whats next, and can try and put themselves in a better position to complete those objectives when the time comes, or sappers can go an pop stuff open early knowing that soon there are going to be people walking through those doors.
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well I have described the clan-commander situation. Trying to do commander on public is not that interesting, imo (too many issues possible there) ... so all my arguments should be taken as my opinion for clan play not for public.
about my argument that commander is not needed if all know what to do... well this can be applied ONLY for ideal game when you are strong enough not to have any problems. We have played few games where opponent was much weaker then us and than only think I needed to do was asking if all is OK (realy no comander was needed)... Imo this should be goal for team - to have so good teamwork that no commander is needed - even if that is impossible
about my argument that commander is not needed if all know what to do... well this can be applied ONLY for ideal game when you are strong enough not to have any problems. We have played few games where opponent was much weaker then us and than only think I needed to do was asking if all is OK (realy no comander was needed)... Imo this should be goal for team - to have so good teamwork that no commander is needed - even if that is impossible
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I find that if you typically make suggestions that make sense most player will attempt to follow them. Like the Russians on Odessa, I will usually state ppsh's to the apartments, rifles and mgs to the square etc. Or once they are capped announce the next objective to get people moving in that direction. That way they can as Colt put it lone wolf their way toward the same target and hopefully overwhelm the opponents.
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yip, true teamwork is excessivly hard to find and usualy happens on a small scale.... if we had some form of 3d voip OR a way of directing your voip at one person (everyone hears it but that person knows its meant for them), then teamwork would be greater. ie on large tank maps you can tell that "other t34 down at the base of the central heights that theres a tiger on your 5 oclock", which would be changed to "hey (name) theres a tiger on your 5", its shorter, and alot less unneeded info.
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What if some smacktards occupy the most important classes (sniper and machinegunner) and are camping and noobing around like mad? And what if they are not listening to the commander commands? You and you're team are doomed imho.
I think RO needs to give squad leaders a limited quantitiy of legal Teamkills that he may commit, just to orden the insubordinates. Just like it was in the good old days 51+ years ago.
Ofcourse, the squad leader-class gets even more responsibility that way. That is why the player with the highest score (the best player) should have entry to the Squad Leader class.
It's abit like the commander-system in Battlefield 2.
See it like an Admin role- a light version.
I think RO needs to give squad leaders a limited quantitiy of legal Teamkills that he may commit, just to orden the insubordinates. Just like it was in the good old days 51+ years ago.
Ofcourse, the squad leader-class gets even more responsibility that way. That is why the player with the highest score (the best player) should have entry to the Squad Leader class.
It's abit like the commander-system in Battlefield 2.
See it like an Admin role- a light version.
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A note on the 'leader' slots in-game:
Too many times a new person (or a glory hound) will snap up a Leader slot in the game. Let me emphasize this: IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEAN YOU'RE IN COMMAND OF THE TEAM.
If someone experienced is in that slot and knows how to handle a particular map, by all means go for it and git 'r done. Otherwise, if you are new to the game or dont' have the cajones to take charge, DON'T take that slot in the first place.
Now, that being said, the Team Leader can be anyone, not just the person who 'wears the hat'; he can be a rifleman, an AT guy, or a tanker. As long as he knows what's what. Being the 'Commander' will often mean that you're the errand boy for calling in arty strikes and such and not much more; not very glamorous. BUT, if you're in that slot you'd BETTER know how to mark and call artillery, because of you don't your teammates WILL turn on you like a pack of wolves.
And don't for one minute think that giving up a Commander slot is a 'demotion'; on the contrary, if it's turning over an asset (artillery) to someone who knows how to properly use it, you'll find yourself on a winning side many times.
Too many times a new person (or a glory hound) will snap up a Leader slot in the game. Let me emphasize this: IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEAN YOU'RE IN COMMAND OF THE TEAM.
If someone experienced is in that slot and knows how to handle a particular map, by all means go for it and git 'r done. Otherwise, if you are new to the game or dont' have the cajones to take charge, DON'T take that slot in the first place.
Now, that being said, the Team Leader can be anyone, not just the person who 'wears the hat'; he can be a rifleman, an AT guy, or a tanker. As long as he knows what's what. Being the 'Commander' will often mean that you're the errand boy for calling in arty strikes and such and not much more; not very glamorous. BUT, if you're in that slot you'd BETTER know how to mark and call artillery, because of you don't your teammates WILL turn on you like a pack of wolves.
And don't for one minute think that giving up a Commander slot is a 'demotion'; on the contrary, if it's turning over an asset (artillery) to someone who knows how to properly use it, you'll find yourself on a winning side many times.
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lols i cant remember how many times ive just gone syko on our team commander in spawn, i tked him until either he left or i got kicked. its funny how many maps i can remember loosing because some little twirp decided he could have the commander position.
a team should have the right to vote their commander out of his position.
a team should have the right to vote their commander out of his position.
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Indeed, a way to dislodge a retarded CO would be awesome.
I'm tired of people on Kaukasus going "Hey, look, the G41," and the Germans proceed to get owned because the Squad Leader never throws smoke and never enters cap zones......
Grrrr.
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If players could vote to remove their commander from his position, it would turn into bf2 and people would be voting him away because they want it, etc.
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And note that the bulk of the posts in this thread all point to ONE thing- TEAMWORK. Teamwork, at its very basic, is a bunch of guys (and girls, occasionally) working TOGETHER to accomplish a goal, in our case it's winning on the battlefield. By extension, this leads to the obvious concept of practice WITH A TEAM so that everyone is on the same sheet of music out there.
So, how does one practice with a team to get this level of competence? It naturally follows that in the main this indicates UNIT or CLAN organization; either way, the unit/clan in question will invariably have some sort of 'chain of command' to be followed in the field. In that case, whoever the ranking man is in that unit/clan's participation, HE is the designated leader. If it comes to pass that he is simply not competent, if the unit is on the up-and-up he'll be quickly replaced or reassigned, giving the next go-getter a crack at battlefield command.
I believe, even though it's not 'official policy', that the heart of RO is- just as on the real battlefield- team organization and competent employment of battlefield assets. Translated, that simply means cooperation. As I've said in many previous posts, Lone Wolves can certainly accomplish great things, but it's the players who work together that consistently win.
So, how does one practice with a team to get this level of competence? It naturally follows that in the main this indicates UNIT or CLAN organization; either way, the unit/clan in question will invariably have some sort of 'chain of command' to be followed in the field. In that case, whoever the ranking man is in that unit/clan's participation, HE is the designated leader. If it comes to pass that he is simply not competent, if the unit is on the up-and-up he'll be quickly replaced or reassigned, giving the next go-getter a crack at battlefield command.
I believe, even though it's not 'official policy', that the heart of RO is- just as on the real battlefield- team organization and competent employment of battlefield assets. Translated, that simply means cooperation. As I've said in many previous posts, Lone Wolves can certainly accomplish great things, but it's the players who work together that consistently win.
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the main problem is that theres the noobs who want to work as a team, and their good. then theres the noobs who want to treat this as any other game and be an uber loan wolf, and think that teamwork is for noobs. sadley they mould the other noobs to become nonteamworkers
the most fun i have in thisgame is when i get 4 or 6 buddies and we all start workin as a team, ive had some small squad style groups going and its bloody fun!
the most fun i have in thisgame is when i get 4 or 6 buddies and we all start workin as a team, ive had some small squad style groups going and its bloody fun!
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I completely agree- there are 'noobs' who are quite good and who are willing to work as a team, as opposed to the nOObs who just want to screw it up for everyone else.
For those in the first category, it should be upon the more experienced to take them under wing and 'get their minds right' before they have an attack of teamkill-itis and wind up in the secnod category. If this means putting them in the junior pwner section of an established unit/clan for a time, so be it- if it's simply noting their name and keeping an eye out for them in the pubs, that's fine as well.
The point is to SHOW new people how to act in-game- and do so by example. To steal a line from 'Enemy at the Gates': 'We should give them examples- but examples to follow. We need our heroes.' And note that all heroes aren't uber-pwners, either- some kid out there (or even some older player) might think the world of YOU if you take the time to teach him the ropes instead of running off to rack up a score. YOU be the hero and make our RO community a better place to play.
For those in the first category, it should be upon the more experienced to take them under wing and 'get their minds right' before they have an attack of teamkill-itis and wind up in the secnod category. If this means putting them in the junior pwner section of an established unit/clan for a time, so be it- if it's simply noting their name and keeping an eye out for them in the pubs, that's fine as well.
The point is to SHOW new people how to act in-game- and do so by example. To steal a line from 'Enemy at the Gates': 'We should give them examples- but examples to follow. We need our heroes.' And note that all heroes aren't uber-pwners, either- some kid out there (or even some older player) might think the world of YOU if you take the time to teach him the ropes instead of running off to rack up a score. YOU be the hero and make our RO community a better place to play.
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