Idea: remove gameyness from ROO
- Thread starter Cyion
- Start date
I think the map makers can control the spawn times... so its a question for the mappers no?
I agree, its fun when you spawn 8 ppl together and move in as one team...
Waiting to respawn is another...
Instead I tried to suggest "group respawns" meaning that IE 4 players has to die to make a respawn.
In this way, if 4 ppl dies by one nade they immidiatly respawn together...
If only 1 die, he has to wait for 3 more to respawn.
If only 1 dies and nobody else dies, he will have to wait for 30 sec to respawn, if 3 more dies within a short time, he will imidatly respawn.
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Benefits:
+ May spawn quicker than a fixed 30 sec spawn time.
+ You will ALLWAYS spawn in groups
+ No/less single respawns and solo behaviour
Possible Sideeffects:
- Players may suicide to let group respawn quicker
I agree, its fun when you spawn 8 ppl together and move in as one team...
Waiting to respawn is another...
Instead I tried to suggest "group respawns" meaning that IE 4 players has to die to make a respawn.
In this way, if 4 ppl dies by one nade they immidiatly respawn together...
If only 1 die, he has to wait for 3 more to respawn.
If only 1 dies and nobody else dies, he will have to wait for 30 sec to respawn, if 3 more dies within a short time, he will imidatly respawn.
-------------------------
Benefits:
+ May spawn quicker than a fixed 30 sec spawn time.
+ You will ALLWAYS spawn in groups
+ No/less single respawns and solo behaviour
Possible Sideeffects:
- Players may suicide to let group respawn quicker
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That would work well on smaller maps, but other options would have to be thought up for the larger ones. You may accidentally take an allied bullet at the start, then sit for a good while while the two teams try to find each other. (I've seen maps go for several minutes without a shot fired.)
Though I do like this idea a lot.
Though I do like this idea a lot.
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MOHAA had its 'gameyness' balanced by a 3rd party mod called CKR. Others followed but all tweaked damage balistics etc.
COD2 had its 'gameyness balanced by a 3rd party mod. LAR amongst others
I see a pattern developing here.
Take the game as it is out of the box and add (if you desire it for your server) a 3rd party mod/mutator.
Over to those who want to adjust/remodel/rework the game.
As it is out of the box its perfectly playable, though it has flaws.
If a mod/tweaker is needed ( and according to this thread and others it is) then it would seem the best way to do it is via a mutator.
Can one of the tefal heads here let me know if thats possible or am I just talking out of my hoop?
COD2 had its 'gameyness balanced by a 3rd party mod. LAR amongst others
I see a pattern developing here.
Take the game as it is out of the box and add (if you desire it for your server) a 3rd party mod/mutator.
Over to those who want to adjust/remodel/rework the game.
As it is out of the box its perfectly playable, though it has flaws.
If a mod/tweaker is needed ( and according to this thread and others it is) then it would seem the best way to do it is via a mutator.
Can one of the tefal heads here let me know if thats possible or am I just talking out of my hoop?
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This was only true early in the war. From the middle of 1943 on Russian infantry was generally superior to German due to attrition. The Russians were easily able to replace even very large losses with new men and had an expanding pool of experienced soldiers as well. The Germans had to make up losses by combing out second and third line units. By 1945 they were routinely using old men and boys
If you're going to give the Russians poorer soldiers for the sake of realism, then you need to give the Germans even poorer ones for late war maps, as well as half strength units.
If you don't want it to be "gamey" then Konigsplatz should feature 5 Germans (with NO artillery!) against 25 Russians.
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I really don't find comments like "why don't you remove respawns because it is gamey" helpful at all. The statement that if there was no 'Gamey'ness then one team would always lose is a lie. You get a bunch of skilled players on one team with ****ty weapons and they will own a team with great weapons. Keep the cliche lines out of the thread.
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F
Field Marshal Rommel
Guest
No! The Tiger I's equivialant which the devs did a good job researching was the IS-2! If you look at both tanks they are pretty much even. The T-34/85 or 76 had a thin 45mm of armor 1 88mm round( to the hull or turret) would obliterate it. no deflections at all just t-34 wreckage everwhere.
How about limited respawns for the Germans?
That was on the Western front. Germany's elite were on the Eastern front with the exception of Berlin. Where "little kids"(Hitler youth) and civilians contrubuted massive Panzerfaust tank kills.
-I think both sides should get differnt maps based on what they know or think they know about the enemies defensive or offensive postions.
-Limited ammo
-A wider varity of vehicles not just tanks
-more Soviet /German antitank weapons -Rpg-43, "German bunched grenades"
-tank deflection fixes
-artillery/airsupport (very realistic germans only lacked artillery on very late war maps 1945)for Germans on earlier maps(1941-late 1944).
- Fix mg-42/34
-bailing out of tank fix
-fix the soviet at-rifle( way 2 powerful!)give em the semiauto if u have to.
-satchels shouldnt kill or damage tanks unless placed on tank.
-the Svt-40 still needs to be taken out of later war maps!(Svt-40 sniper variant was taken out of service in 1942)
- Tank guns especially the 88 should cause real damage!
-Tank armor needs looking in to su-76 ect.
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F
Field Marshal Rommel
Guest
Well, yes that would be nice both sides had them(the Germans mass produced molotov cocktail bottles) but Id think it would be difficult to code and model.
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to remove the gameyness, tripwire should release RO: Ostfront 2.0 in an event form, they invite the whole comunity and give us real ww2 weapons and equipment, and then we kill each other, so we get the more realistic experience possible
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That would work well on smaller maps, but other options would have to be thought up for the larger ones. You may accidentally take an allied bullet at the start, then sit for a good while while the two teams try to find each other. (I've seen maps go for several minutes without a shot fired.)
Though I do like this idea a lot.
I think you forgot this point
* If only 1 dies and nobody else, he will have to wait for 30-40 sec to respawn.
Note: This to prevent excessive waiting on large maps as you said.
On large maps I guess it would be good with abit more respawn time to increase the chance for spawning in groups anyway, no?
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hehe, well... I think like this...
Yes, lets do 5 germans against 25 russians!!!
BUT let the russians loose if they cannot beat the historical outcome.
THus instead of WINNING the ***ing war by pushing the russians out of the map, the axis team win by competing with the historical outcome.
This will remove the gamyness.
Yes the axis will suffer heavy losses, but if they manage to stay alive and defend for a prolonged time against all odds, they win the battle.
This may be due to holding back the russians for supplies to arrive...
The germans loose if the Russians manage to overrun the axis and get a defensive hold in the sector etc.
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we could probably remove some of the gamieness because in rl the war was quite ballanced. take arad realism as an example, if the russians try and shoot it out with the germans , theyr phucked, if they charge or flank and get around the german tanks the germans phucked. with a higher level of realism and some of those ballances taken out , it forces people to use more TACTICS, not just drive toward the enemies and shoot at them. in the western front the tank ratio was 4 shermans to kill 1 german tank, but it was also 10 shermans produced for 1 tiger produced. in terms of the eastern front that would meen the ruskies would get say 10 t34 85s and 3-4 76's, and the germans would get 2-3 tigers and 3 panther tanks. sure the germans have less, but if they use proper tactics they can slaughter the ruskies, if the ruskies use proper tactics they can slaughter the germans.
the same goes for infantry combat, a rifleman shouldent be able to win so easily at 30 feet against a submachine gunner, i mean the reason they actually make smgs is because at closer distances they are BETTER than rifles, meenwhile in game over a distance of 25-30 feet, a rifeler will win mosta the time...
the same goes for infantry combat, a rifleman shouldent be able to win so easily at 30 feet against a submachine gunner, i mean the reason they actually make smgs is because at closer distances they are BETTER than rifles, meenwhile in game over a distance of 25-30 feet, a rifeler will win mosta the time...
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There are side effects on short respawn times also. Maps get boring, because after the second time you play a map you know it all, "rambo" tactics are rewarding, people abuse explosive weapons as grenades and teamwork is next to none.
Also, you will be tired much sooner of a game where 99% of the time you are shooting or running than of one where you are going to wait long times after you die. "Fear of dying" is not only a mere tool to disadvantage rambos or grenade-spammers, it's also a consistent part of a game. An example of this is the popularity reached by games such as America's Army or Counter-Strike (and for some elements Unreal Tournament and similar ones). If you die, you have to be penalized in some way, otherwise you'll soon find the game pointless and stop playing it (as part of the playerbase seems already be doing so).
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This is true. Hitler himself is photographed pinning Iron Crosses on the drafted Hitler Youth, including a 12 year old boy in Berlin in APril 1945. The Axis on Konigszlats should all spawn 4 feet tall with high pitched voices who get tired trying to carry those big heavy rifles while running.
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agree!
I get a kick outa hearing peeps say a map is bias for one side or the other when they lose.
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