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Teamkill Forgiveness

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Teamkill Forgiveness

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#41
nodachi said:
The system is fine, you get punished for mistakes. i'm pretty sure you will be repremanded in real life if you accedently nading your own machinegun nest.
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sorry but i completly disagree with you very strongly, (did you even read the argument??)

example: (as was mentioned before), If i am playing as the satchel guy and blowing objectives what am i sapposed to do when i plant a satchel in open view, and someone who saw me plant it runs up to the wall where i did..... as i despertly try to scream at him to move before it blows i get a TK, now its probobly because he is new or something... BUT it comes down to IT WAS NOT MY FAULT, but i could easily get kicked from the game!!!

this is just bad because it kicks me out, but it also encourages ressentment for "those stupid newbs", which makes the game less open to new players etc....

i would much rather have this feature then another map or weapon..... this is where the time should be spent....
 
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#42
slyder73 said:
Giving the dead player an option to forgive does not work. They tried that in Battlefield2, and the overwhelming majority of players automaticlly punished, regardless of circumstance. Even without the punish, people would not forgive in general. Oddly, psychology proves this LOL, all those experiments they did with people hooked up to electrodes or the participants thinking someone is hooked up to an electrode...then giving someone the power to give electric shocks to people without punishment, reason, or being identified. What did they find? That the vastly overwhelming majority of people will punish (shock) the victim regardless of circumstances in the experiment or the "rules" that were suppoed to bring on punishment.
Long and short of it, give people power to do harm in little ways without restitution and they will.
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the way people play BF2 and this are much different (i used to play alot of BF2) on here i see alot of "sorry" then "its ok", if we had the option of forgiving.... im not saying that it would Solve the problem, but it would help.
 
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#44
Malborex said:
A small first Step i would like to see is, removing TK from Arti. When the commander places Artillery and his Teammates run in the Target Area and die why should he be punished?Everone can look at the map and see where the arti is coming and avoid that area.
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Do this and I will intentionally bombard my spawn with artillery just to prove how much of a dumb idea that is.
 
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#48
A couple of ideas

A couple of ideas

I definetly like the idea of punishing a tker by not giving him an NP if he deserves it or on the other hand helping him out and not getting him kicked if it was an accident. here are some things to think about;

a. there should be a countdown timer befor you are kicked. Here's why, if you drop a dead nade and tk 4 or 5 team members, they would have enough time to give you an NP before the server automatically kicks you.

b. A tk from a satchel placed on an blastable objective or obstical should NEVER be punished. nor should tk's from passengers jumping out of moving vehicles

c. Binding keys to forgive or punish might be a good idea

d. Sometimes you don't want to forgive accidents. you might think to yourself "i was just about to finish capping that objective, why the heck would someone throw a gernad there"

e. I think that the sevarity of TK's are better realized when tk forgivenes is implemented. Big bold letters across the top of your screen giving you a warning definetly grabs your attention. It also makes players hope they get forgiven and think about their TK for a bit.

f. Maybe show how many tk's you are away from being kicked? (not sure if this would be good or bad)
 
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#49
<animal>FUR said:
I definetly like the idea of punishing a tker by not giving him an NP if he deserves it or on the other hand helping him out and not getting him kicked if it was an accident. here are some things to think about;

a. there should be a countdown timer befor you are kicked. Here's why, if you drop a dead nade and tk 4 or 5 team members, they would have enough time to give you an NP before the server automatically kicks you.

b. A tk from a satchel placed on an blastable objective or obstical should NEVER be punished. nor should tk's from passengers jumping out of moving vehicles

c. Binding keys to forgive or punish might be a good idea

d. Sometimes you don't want to forgive accidents. you might think to yourself "i was just about to finish capping that objective, why the heck would someone throw a gernad there"

e. I think that the sevarity of TK's are better realized when tk forgivenes is implemented. Big bold letters across the top of your screen giving you a warning definetly grabs your attention. It also makes players hope they get forgiven and think about their TK for a bit.

f. Maybe show how many tk's you are away from being kicked? (not sure if this would be good or bad)
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To maintain a semblance of realism some of these suggestions wouldn't work. No TK for being close to a destructuable objective for example. Part of realism is not being able to stand right next to a bomb while it goes off. And jumping out of moving vehicles. Can go both ways. With good teamwork the driver should be slowing to let people out and guys shouldn't be jumping out of a moving vehicle, yet sometimes you get drivers that drive like idiots and you have to jump out.
I still maintain that the vast majority of TK's due to people doing something stupid and getting themselves killed would not be forgiven. The guy who ran into the satchel or arty without paying attention will not forgive, it's a proven fact. (Yes, I know the vast majority on this website say they will, so do I. But this site only reflects the players who are into the game enough to come to the website, thus those are more mature and interested in the forums, not reflective of the general player population)

THe simplest solution would be to just change the criteria for auto-kicking. Rather than a standard 3 TK's for a kick for example, make it 3 TK's for weapon kills, 8 for arty and 6 for satchel. Something like that would help take into account the accidents and idiots. It also keeps the realism factor in game, and still encourages team communication in the form of informing team where the bombs and arty will be and where to stay clear from etc. I've noticed a lot lately that many arty/satchel TK's are due to severe lack of team communication.
 
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#52
slyder73 said:
To maintain a semblance of realism some of these suggestions wouldn't work. No TK for being close to a destructuable objective for example. Part of realism is not being able to stand right next to a bomb while it goes off. And jumping out of moving vehicles. quote]


I never said that the person shouldn't die from a satchel planted by a team member. we are talking about the penalties for a TK, (ie minus points and getting kicked) not trying to implement some sorta magical frendly fire protection as you are suggesting. :D
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#53
When we played Wolf:ET way back yonder, we'd always forgive a teammate because thats what he was. A team mate. Why go pi**ing off people you're trying to work with and want to be able to rely on? Everyone makes mistakes. Everyone gets killed with a live grenade.

If someone calls you an a**hat just because you made a mistake in a game.. you don't learn from it. Sorry. You do. You learn resentment and how to behave like an a**hat.

If someone replies np or explains what you did wrong .. then you learn positive things and improve which is to everyones benefit.

I personally like the Wolf implementation as it did make you realise you were in a team and relied on your team. Thats something alot of people seem to be missing.
 
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#54
I don't see the point in punishing a team mate for stupidity or negligence on my part. I mean I'm the idiot that wandered into the arty strike w/o looking at the map. The capped while throwing a grenade & killing a buddy falls under the it happens category. I doubt the opposition will let you get away with " time out & cease fire cause I'm gonna throw a grenade".
 
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#57
Monkwarrior said:
I made the np-mutator.
Somebody else tried to make it more stable, but I'm afraid it still is unstable.
It's not on my priority list, but I do have the source (not his version but my "older" version). So if someone cann't find the source code and wants to take a crack at it: let me know.

Monk.
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Any progress? I really wan't the "np" system back. I hate being squad leader and being banned for an entire match for tk'ing, even though the intial two bombardments of artlillery kill 10+ enemies. It's a big issue on Konig and now parizer-platz, and dont get me wroung I am carefull where I lay down arty, it's just that people are too careless to check the objective map.

So please if anyone is an able coder remake the forgive system! An able commander shouldnt fear the wrath of his men's stupidity!
 
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#59
we had this system on a tactical realism cod2 server, and it worked pretty fine,

when you TK someone, you apolegise to him and then he pressed a key combination (that i forgot) like F2-F (forgive) or F2-G (grudge), when you get forgiven the TK doesnt count, but if you get 3 grudges you get kicked.

i remember once teamkilling 6 teammates at start of S&D round, because i spawned in with a grenade in my hand. so then i inmediately explained what happened, and most forgave me, so i didn't get kicked.

here you get kicked inmediately, sometimes even before your kill shows up. in COD2 there was a countdown, you had 30 seconds to get forgiven.
 
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#60
slyder73 said:
THe simplest solution would be to just change the criteria for auto-kicking. Rather than a standard 3 TK's for a kick for example, make it 3 TK's for weapon kills, 8 for arty and 6 for satchel. Something like that would help take into account the accidents and idiots.
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Yes, this is a must. I read somewhere else in the forum that there are few servers who use a similar thing. the best thing to do, IMO, is that FF punishment should be applied after 6-12 TKs, but:
nade,arty= 1
non scoped weapon=2
sniper,bayo=3

and, on topic- I play Dod as well, and though you dont find them a lot, there are some servers who use the tkforgive feature- an easy drop down menu on the left side of screen, numbers r the yes\no keys (there r more options than yes and no but they r not suited to ro as they impend realism)- and it works great. many ppl forgive- maybe they just check your score and see u r doing good 4 the team and they wanna win etc.
and Dod players r considered immature...
(again- I admit that this system is hardly used there and most servers just gave up and disabled ff all an all, but I can only speak from my personal experience, if it was there- it has done the job)
 
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