Swedish Prime Minister talks about Peak Oil
- Thread starter Ghad
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87 Octane sells for around $3.25 - $3.60 a gallon USD here on Californias' Central Coast. Three years ago it sold for around $1.35... it has almost trippled. 
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kabex said:When/if "peak oil" happens me and my compatriots are going to throw a big ass party on our oil money.
What company do you work for? Im just finishing up my undergrad degree in Petroleum Engineering at the University of Texas. I'll probably be starting my masters in roughly a year or so.
Right now im looking at getting a job with any of the majors except Shell. Also looking at Anadarko or Pioneer.
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I was making a semi-smart ass comment. In Mexico, the oil is a federal resource, it's the peoples.inmate said:
All the profits made from Mexican oil go to federal funding, it helps pay for education, for health care, for public works, for welfare programs, etc.
We, the Mexicans, own our oil. Everytime oil prices rise, PEMEX(our national oil company) scores record profits, and this translates into more money for the government, which results in more and better public services. Currently, 6 out of 10 barrels are used in Mexico, and we have massive production(#5 exporter in the world iirc), so we are never going to have any oil problems, it can only be beneficial.
Unlike in the US, and most of the world, oil isn't owned by 5 guys, who make billions of dollars and live extremely opulent lives, wielding massive political power and influence.
Here, oil makes no one rich but the country itself.
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Also, to people complaining about paying $3-4usd per galon... lol. That's cheap!
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Yeah, we pay 90 odd pence a litre in England, that's roughly $1.66 a litre or $6.30 a gallon.
I'd forgotton about other products made from oil, but has anyone been to the Eden Project? They had a whole display on theories and research into extracting oil and from plants. Does anyone know how viable that actually might be?
I'd forgotton about other products made from oil, but has anyone been to the Eden Project? They had a whole display on theories and research into extracting oil and from plants. Does anyone know how viable that actually might be?
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Well, obviously one should never write off the possibilities for alternatives, look at how Germany made do with minimal sources of oil during WWII.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_oil
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_fuel
Anyway:
The pessimistic thesis on peak oil isnt that we will run out of oil per se, but that the oil that is will be so expensive that the we will be unable to sustain the global economy, at the cost of stability.
The positive thesis is that market economy will cause humanity to turn to alternatives, as they will be cost effective once oil becomes more expensive. (Alberta sands, and arctic oil fields being two examples) Lets hope the oil companies hasnt sabotaged this version already.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_oil
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synthetic_fuel
Anyway:
The pessimistic thesis on peak oil isnt that we will run out of oil per se, but that the oil that is will be so expensive that the we will be unable to sustain the global economy, at the cost of stability.
The positive thesis is that market economy will cause humanity to turn to alternatives, as they will be cost effective once oil becomes more expensive. (Alberta sands, and arctic oil fields being two examples) Lets hope the oil companies hasnt sabotaged this version already.
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The problem isnt that we'll run out of oil, even if that WILL happen eventually, the oil companies preventing the development of alternatives is a problem, but its only part of it, the real problem is that this world, the industrial revolution, this modern world, the one and only reason it exists in its current form, and the only reason the number of people in the world has been six-doubled the last 200 years is cheap energy. This world is like a car running on extreme nitro boost, it ran before you turned on the nitro, and it wont stop running once its out, but it'll pretty much feel like it.
The thing about oil vs alternatives is that there are none. you can use 1 liter or gallon of oil and use it to pump up 30 or a hundred with them. Every single other source of energy we have have a ratio of 1 to 1 or maybe 1 to 5 in the best cases. its simple math, unless we figure out something that can compete with oil/fossile fuels ratio, the world simply cant go on like it does.
The thing about oil vs alternatives is that there are none. you can use 1 liter or gallon of oil and use it to pump up 30 or a hundred with them. Every single other source of energy we have have a ratio of 1 to 1 or maybe 1 to 5 in the best cases. its simple math, unless we figure out something that can compete with oil/fossile fuels ratio, the world simply cant go on like it does.
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BicycleRepairMan said:
I for one don't see the problem with that (oil companies would beg to differ, of course
). Maybe then the US will seriously start looking at public transportation and alternative energy sources. It is my firm belief that (at least for the next 10-15 years) if the US doesn't make a jump, no one else is going to. Granted, several European countries are talking about and planning a lot of things, but the results have been scattered and under-implemented at best. Once the US breaks free of its petrophillia (new word? ) things will shape up in other parts of the world faster, but I think the window for that is quickly closing. Once another country develops something that *is* a new viable alternative, the US will be on the trailing end and have to play catch up (like we're currently doing with education, health care, etc.). I just hope that the up-tops realize this sooner rather than later
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Arnt artifical carbon based fuels are actually more efficent in everyway.
Like alcohol from fermenting sweet potatoe or wateva.
Dosnt it burn better in you car and cheaper to make?
Anyway oil companys arnt stupid they want prices high but they also wont lose their monopoly on energy so im sure before 2020 shell will have some huge potatoe farm or somthing along those lines.
Anyone seen bmws v12 H2 powerd car its combustion?!
Anyway I heard somewhere alcohol was one of the cleanest fuels for you car.
Like alcohol from fermenting sweet potatoe or wateva.
Dosnt it burn better in you car and cheaper to make?
Anyway oil companys arnt stupid they want prices high but they also wont lose their monopoly on energy so im sure before 2020 shell will have some huge potatoe farm or somthing along those lines.
Anyone seen bmws v12 H2 powerd car its combustion?!
Anyway I heard somewhere alcohol was one of the cleanest fuels for you car.
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THG repo said:
There are SEVERAL cleaner sources of fuel, however the problem is typically (as pointed out above) the power-ratio. If you can burn your motor for say, 30 miles on a gallon of regular gasoline, compared to 18 miles on a gallon of some kind of fuel made from excrement, even though you've made an incredible way of disposing of fertilizer you still are missing those extra 12 miles.
There are more things coming along that are getting within the ranges of fossil fuels, though. It's still giong to take a massive and concious cultural shift for it to happen though. It's not going to be where you just wake up one day and realize 'oh! I'm the only guy on the block that doesn't have a hydrogen car!' or whatnot.
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Anyway, hydrogen cars is not going to be THE solution, because they are not any more energy-effective than petrol cars.
You will need heaps of electricity to create all that hydrogen, and that needs to come from somewhere.
So that leaves us back on the power-ratio thingy.
You will need heaps of electricity to create all that hydrogen, and that needs to come from somewhere.
So that leaves us back on the power-ratio thingy.
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Ghad said:
I wasn't meaning we'd all be driving hydrogen cars, I was just using that to paint a picture of the argument
Sorry for the misunderstanding.
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No offense meant mate , I just think it's an important point to make clear. Many are getting confused by that point, and think that if they get themselves an electric car, then they are saving the environment. Well they are not, they are only removing the pollution from where the car is, to where the energi is extracted. (Power plants of any sort)
, I just think it's an important point to make clear. Many are getting confused by that point, and think that if they get themselves an electric car, then they are saving the environment. Well they are not, they are only removing the pollution from where the car is, to where the energi is extracted. (Power plants of any sort)
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87 Octane is about $2.70 here right now
anyway, frankly I don't worry about future energy sources, necessity is the mother of invention
besides, why not just build some of these?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_towers
I have a big pdf explaining them in detail if anyone wants it
anyway, frankly I don't worry about future energy sources, necessity is the mother of invention
besides, why not just build some of these?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_towers
I have a big pdf explaining them in detail if anyone wants it
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One minor problem mabye,
"The tower should optimally be situated in a hot dry climate, which thus allows for the greatest extraction of energy from the air. The need for large quantities of water may be solved by choosing a location that is not too far from the coast"
Finding somewhere that fits that and is also near a densly populated area? I guenuenly don't know about America (Aren't the megalopoli on the coast in hot dry areas? In which case it may work over there), but you're going to have problems in Europe. I still think tidal energy is the way to go for places like Britian, it will run all year round, have no problems with the temperature and weather and we've got plenty of coast.
But yes, you're right (hopefully). When the demand comes ideas will come along too especially if they're profitable ideas.
"The tower should optimally be situated in a hot dry climate, which thus allows for the greatest extraction of energy from the air. The need for large quantities of water may be solved by choosing a location that is not too far from the coast"
Finding somewhere that fits that and is also near a densly populated area? I guenuenly don't know about America (Aren't the megalopoli on the coast in hot dry areas? In which case it may work over there), but you're going to have problems in Europe. I still think tidal energy is the way to go for places like Britian, it will run all year round, have no problems with the temperature and weather and we've got plenty of coast.
But yes, you're right (hopefully). When the demand comes ideas will come along too especially if they're profitable ideas.
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I'll have to read through it again, but I'm pretty sure it states the technology itself is productive enough and there are enough appropriate areas in the world to produce energy for the entire world at West Europe levels of consumption
*ah here it is
"All over the world there are about 40 countries which have suitable climatic
Invest in Energy Towers now!
*ah here it is
"All over the world there are about 40 countries which have suitable climatic
conditions for the installation of Energy Towers. The theoretical potential is big enough to provide at least
ten times the entire world consumption of electricity at western European levels"
ten times the entire world consumption of electricity at western European levels"
Invest in Energy Towers now!
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Ghad said:
Recently there has been found a solution for this.
It seems bacteria can produce Hydrogen in a much more cost-effective way out of biological waist. Of course it still has other problems, but it sure looks very promising.
Monk.
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Couldn't agree more. Big businesses won't ever do "the right thing" on their own. All they care about is money, it's their God. The only thing they compute is $$$$$. So until they can rake in obscene profits with alternative fuels they will do nothing. People have the power to demand alternatives but don't use it (boycott). Most people don't care until it affects their wallet. Funny thing is I think the electric car was invented before the internal combustion engine.Tak said:
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