• Please make sure you are familiar with the forum rules. You can find them here: https://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/index.php?threads/forum-rules.2334636/

My thoughts

Cyper

Grizzled Veteran
Sep 25, 2011
1,290
1,005
Sweden
First and foremost: All my respect to the people at Tripwire. You've done an outstanding job. But, my feeling for the game right now is like Edward H. Harriman said; Much good work is lost for the lack of a little more. This game got a great foundation that, in my opinion is lost due to several reasons that you will find in the text you're about to read. If you want to take the time to do so.


Now, I have tried to enjoy the game for 16 hours now. I've died 803 times in and killed over 1064 enemies. It feels like this is mostly what I do in the game: Sprint, kill, die respawn, or camp, die respawn, over and over agian.

The timelimit for each match reminds me of a quickmatch in COD. The maps are crowded with people; sometimes you get shot down and die at spawn. The weapons are so precise and easy to handle that you'll get your head blown off all the time. The ability to use your eyes as a binocular makes it ever harder. It's hardcore in the wrong way. One shot one kill is great, but you can't mix this with weapons that are extremely precise and easy to handle. Only the more aggressive players get rewarded simply because they don't care if they die 35 times in one match.

In RO:OST the weapons had a lot more recoil. You weren't able to zoom in with your eyes to spot enemies at distance and the rifles were a lot harder to aim with. Any type of concealmeent is more or less useless in RO2. You can instantly switch weapon, point, and shoot, and hit the target exactly where you want. You can sprint a large distance and still hold the weapon almost still while in a standing position and while artillery strikes down close to you and bullets whistles around your head. You can zoom in while you aim, and hold your breath forever. Gain XP, and the sway that almost doesn't exist will be decreased even more such as the recoil.

The maps are so small that some of them can be compared to the seize of the maps in COD. Roles such as sniper, commander, AT-soldier, gunner and so suffers a lot from this due to the small, crowded maps, and the high chance to dying. Mix this with a lot of players and you'll spend more time dying by getting shot from people who sprint 80 meters, make an instant stop and aim down the sight in less than a second, shot, and hit a guy across the map in a matter of a second. The guy keeps on sprinting, get hit by a Kar and keep on sprinting like nothing happend, and bandage himself in a foxhole in a matter of a second. In RO:OST you would be slowed down and might even drop your weapon.

A lot of good features are removed aswell. The command radial in the game looks like It's taken from a console game; roughly 70% of all the commands in RO:OST are removed. Commands such as ''sniper'' is useless since a regular rifleman is as effective as the sniper. The feature that made you drop your weapon while being shot is removed aswell.

This may seems like a rant, and maybe it is, but in the end I believe that RO have a lot of potential and it's generally a very good game. But unfortunately, I expected something that was similar to RO:Ost's which this game lacks in. I don't really know where to place it. It feels like the game tries to appeal to a wider audience, and as an affect, it target an audience that doesn't exist. This may be the reason to the decreased players.. I don't know. Because I think this game is to hardcore for the mainstream and to little hardcore for the core fans. Maybe I'm wrong. I don't know?

I will await further announcements, updates, mods and so on, and hopefully I can get back to the game later on. Until that I will play RO:OST's and other games and going around here on the forums. I don't know if other people share my point of view but it would be nice to hear what all of you think, especially the old fans of the game.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Wodin
They removed the artificial skill ceiling that insanely exaggerated recoil & sway were causing.

The mix of tactics & individual skill is still present, but the individual skill now plays a greater role.

Accordingly, RO1 vets are (mostly) getting utterly destroyed game after game by players who are just plain better.

This explains RO2 forums.

Now feed me that negative rep, i'll see you on the right side of the killspam messages :cool:
 
Upvote 0
They removed the artificial skill ceiling that insanely exaggerated recoil & sway were causing.

The mix of tactics & individual skill is still present, but the individual skill now plays a greater role.

Accordingly, RO1 vets are (mostly) getting utterly destroyed game after game by players who are just plain better.

This explains RO2 forums.

Now feed me that negative rep, i'll see you on the right side of the killspam messages :cool:

That's the problem. As an invidual you're not punished by playing in a more aggressive way. The weapon handling is developed in such a way that anyone can shot precise and play the game accordingly.

The most effective way to earn score in RO2 is simply to play very aggressive and apply more COD-like tactics. I've never encountered a problem to earn score and kills personally but I don't accept the fact that It's easy to do so. Because I didn't buy this game for that. Otherwise I can just play Battlefield which does a lot better work on that than RO.

The game is away to accesible. The player should have to struggle to get kills. Also, some players simply accept that they're getting killed and spawn a lot of times. The easiest fix could be a forced, minimum, 4 minute spawning time if you die. In that way you will be punished ammediately. However,this doesn't fix the other issues I've stated in the orginal post.

RO should only be for for players that dedicate themself to the game. Any newcomer's with lack of skills shall face a hardtime to get into the game and there should be no assist.

With other words; RO2 is not what I expected because it's away to much adapted for the mainstream audience compared to RO1. If I wanted a game that was for the mainstream I would wait for battlefield 3. Because that game does the job a lot better than RO. But that was not what I was looking for: I expected RO2 to be more or less like RO1.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Lyndhen
Upvote 0
They removed the artificial skill ceiling that insanely exaggerated recoil & sway were causing.

The mix of tactics & individual skill is still present, but the individual skill now plays a greater role.

Accordingly, RO1 vets are (mostly) getting utterly destroyed game after game by players who are just plain better.

This explains RO2 forums.

Now feed me that negative rep, i'll see you on the right side of the killspam messages :cool:

This reply speaks volumes...especially the last sentence...
 
  • Like
Reactions: dwhee
Upvote 0
RO should only be for for players that dedicate themself to the game. Any newcomer's with lack of skills shall face a hardtime to get into the game and there should be no assist.

Are you TRYING to put Tripwire out of business or something? Right now the blend is perfect. No need to steer it further in either direction. Having realistically accurate weapons work both ways, as your enemy's now more accurate as well. Anybody foolish enough to rush blindly against players with even slight competency dies in a hurry. Same goes with stupid thinkings like taking a bolt action indoor to go against automatics.

Doing stupid things in RO1 gets you killed. Doing stupid things in RO2 STILL gets you killed. I honestly don't see any problems here.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Nimsky
Upvote 0
Are you TRYING to put Tripwire out of business or something? Right now the blend is perfect. No need to steer it further in either direction. Having realistically accurate weapons work both ways, as your enemy's now more accurate as well. Anybody foolish enough to rush without thinking against players with even slight competency dies in a hurry. Same goes stupid thinkings like taking a bolt action indoor to go against automatics.

Doing stupid things in RO1 gets you killed. Doing stupid things in RO2 STILL gets you killed. I honestly don't see any problems here.

No, certainly not.

What I am saying is that RO2 is away to unrealistic in terms of gameplay features compared to the orginal RO. What exactly this is is described in the first post. I'm not saying that they should make the game into a super realistic combat simulator, but what I am saying is that they should keep the game in line with the orginal RO which - in my opinion - is not the case with RO2.
 
Upvote 0
No, certainly not.

What I am saying is that RO2 is away to unrealistic in terms of gameplay features compared to the orginal RO. What exactly this is is described in the first post. I'm not saying that they should make the game into a super realistic combat simulator, but what I am saying is that they should keep the game in line with the orginal RO which - in my opinion - is not the case with RO2.


That's the thing. the accuracy in RO2 IS quite realistic. More so than RO1 in fact. Less recoil and more accuracy on SMG, automatic rifles, etc. The stuffs you considered to be dumbing down to make the game newbie friendly are actually steps toward more realism (Controlling breath to steady aim, bracing weapon sideway against wall, those are all real and effective techniques trained soldiers utilize). It just sounds to me that you're suggesting to artificially limit people's skills, to make the game feels harder, that you're welling to nerf the accuracy and increase the recoil toward the direction not unlike those of Counter-Strike. Which's no way a step toward realism. And all it's gonna do is adding more randomness to the gameplay.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Nimsky
Upvote 0
RO2 = GARBAGE

This is a total waste of money.

There is no way this even compares to the realism of RO1. If you say it does, then your nothing but a COD noob and don't know the difference.

The only chance we have (True RO1 fans) will be the modders. But, this won't happen for about 6 to 8 months out so we will be **** out of luck for awhile. For now, we are stuck with just another "glorified" COD noob shooter game.

TWI- I am very disappointed with your efforts. You spent all your hard earned time on this? Sorry, but this game blows.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nimsky
Upvote 0
RO2 = GARBAGE

This is a total waste of money.

There is no way this even compares to the realism of RO1. If you say it does, then your nothing but a COD noob and don't know the difference.

The only chance we have (True RO1 fans) will be the modders. But, this won't happen for about 6 to 8 months out so we will be **** out of luck for awhile. For now, we are stuck with just another "glorified" COD noob shooter game.

TWI- I am very disappointed with your efforts. You spent all your hard earned time on this? Sorry, but this game blows.

Spoken like somebody who has never shot a gun in his life.

Example, pistol rounds fired from full size submachine guns with open bolt cycling has very little recoil, and are suprisingly accurate. And a properly taken cared bolt action rifle will pretty much always hit dead center as long as you can line up your sights correctly. Just by making weapon kick more and shoot all over the place make the game more difficult to play, yes, but doesn't make it realistic in anyway.

Go to a range sometimes, then you can come back and tell us how realistic guns should feel like. Before you can do that, you don't know crap.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nimsky
Upvote 0
No, certainly not.

What I am saying is that RO2 is away to unrealistic in terms of gameplay features compared to the orginal RO. What exactly this is is described in the first post. I'm not saying that they should make the game into a super realistic combat simulator, but what I am saying is that they should keep the game in line with the orginal RO which - in my opinion - is not the case with RO2.

Quit comparing 1 with 2. Obviously the developers went for a new strategy of blending tactical realism with the fun of a shooter that isn't uber hard on the combat side. If you miss RO1 so much then go play it. Play both for the good points they both offer. There's a reason the RO1 server's are empty.

I think TWI has done outstanding job. Cudos!:)
 
Upvote 0
I can handle the new sway, even the new mystery weapons. I suppose I can take the unlocks and skill grinding too.

What is so dissapointing:

Player communication replaced by repetitive, canned voices. Players should speak, not the game.

Radar. Yes, because WW2 soldiers had HUDs, displaying the location of enemies.

Arbitrary artillery. Tactical mortars are not 120mm, and tactical mortars fall in very tight patterns when danger close.

Maps are arbitrary. The maps have no meaning, and are only remotely attachable to the conflict. RO1 hit it on the head with a breakdown of the units involved, and what happened.

No random team joining. BORING!

No ability to "gg" after a game. This splinters the community into anonymous shooters being presented maps continously, in a vacuum.

btw, I am a long time RO vet, and I own in RO2. Very easy compared to RO. RO2 is too easy, and this is not a good dign for replayability.

TWI should have led the wargamer charge instead of trying to please arcaders and wargamers. An opportunity to truly become immortal in the gaming world by creating and fostering a different shooting paradigm and culture has been lost. For the moment.
 
Upvote 0
Quit comparing 1 with 2. Obviously the developers went for a new strategy of blending tactical realism with the fun of a shooter that isn't uber hard on the combat side. If you miss RO1 so much then go play it. Play both for the good points they both offer. There's a reason the RO1 server's are empty.

I think TWI has done outstanding job. Cudos!:)

I didn't buy RO2 in order to go back to play RO1. Because I expected RO2 to be more like the orginal RO and not implemented with mainstream features.

It's obvious that TWI wanted to appeal to two audiences. Unfortunately, I doubt it will work. The game is too 'mainstreamed' to suit the hardcore audience. The mainstream players will go to BF3 when that's released. Just look at the current player drop. I don't think it will decrease when BF3 is released.

By the way, the reason why the servers in RO1 is almost empty is because the game is old and extremely outdated and because people have been drawn to RO2 since it's released.
 
Upvote 0
Cyper said:
It feels like this is mostly what I do in the game: Sprint, kill, die respawn, or camp, die respawn, over and over agian.
Isn't it what the war is all about?

Cyper said:
The timelimit for each match reminds me of a quickmatch in COD.
Attackers needs a good reason to attack. If they can't capture the zone within certain timelimit should they keep dying over and over again for the round to be over? What's the point? I agree that timelimit isn't wonderful, but I think we are better of with it rather than without. Or present us a solution. Maybe it will work.

Cyper said:
The weapons are so precise and easy to handle that you'll get your head blown off all the time. The ability to use your eyes as a binocular makes it ever harder. It's hardcore in the wrong way. One shot one kill is great, but you can't mix this with weapons that are extremely precise and easy to handle.
I agree that some changes could be done, but not too big. Only to decrease really long range shoots. Effective fire is 300 meters. Most of shoots are between 1-2XX, some are above, and there are really few above 3XX. It's not bad. Some adjustment - yes, maybe. Some sway to make long shoots a bit harder, maybe faster stamina drain and bullet spread. Saying that is it only "run and gun" - no.

Here is a whole discussion about long range combat.

Cyper said:
In RO:OST the weapons had a lot more recoil.
Is RO:OST realistic shooter?

Cyper said:
You weren't able to zoom in with your eyes to spot enemies at distance and the rifles were a lot harder to aim with.
There is no zoom.

About ZOOM.

Cyper said:
Any type of concealmeent is more or less useless in RO2.
Then way it is working? At least from what I can see?

Cyper said:
You can zoom in while you aim, and hold your breath forever.
You can't hold your breath.

Cyper said:
Commands such as ''sniper'' is useless since a regular rifleman is as effective as the sniper.
Sniper rifle has scope on it. It's much easier to snipe with such visual aid. And how long range is for "sniper" to be called such? When you die/kill, what range is it? You can kill people with iron sight and a regular rifle up to 451 meters, while effective combat range is 300.

Cyper said:
This may seems like a rant, and maybe it is, but in the end I believe that RO have a lot of potential and it's generally a very good game. But unfortunately, I expected something that was similar to RO:Ost's which this game lacks in.
Did TWI say they were making just another RO:OST? I don't think it is a rant, but I am not sure if you know what is real and what is not. Can you share your viewpoint on that?

Honestly, for me, it is not as easy to "snipe" people as you make it sound. You die a lot, but such is war. People can kill you from a really long ranges, but I have yet to see "impossible" hit/kill. Most of hits are within a realm of possibility and are quite well placed. There could be some changes, and probably will be, I agree with it, but not so soon. We need time to consider what should be changed and how. And we need to base it on reality, not on our feelings.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Spoken like somebody who has never shot a gun in his life.

Example, pistol rounds fired from full size submachine guns with open bolt cycling has very little recoil, and are suprisingly accurate. And a properly taken cared bolt action rifle will pretty much always hit dead center as long as you can line up your sights correctly. Just by making weapon kick more and shoot all over the place make the game more difficult to play, yes, but doesn't make it realistic in anyway.

Go to a range sometimes, then you can come back and tell us how realistic guns should feel like. Before you can do that, you don't know crap.

Hey danshyu or whatever your stupid *** name is...don't state your comments when you don't know what the hell you are talking about, especially about me. You freaking noob...I was in the U.S. Army for 10+ years, so I think I know what I am talking about. Spoken like a childish little punk, as yourself.
 
  • Like
Reactions: danshyu and monster
Upvote 0
Hey danshyu or whatever your stupid *** name is...don't state your comments when you don't know what the hell you are talking about, especially about me. You freaking noob...I was in the U.S. Army for 10+ years, so I think I know what I am talking about. Spoken like a childish little punk, as yourself.

And my real name is Barrack Obama.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Nimsky
Upvote 0
Hey danshyu or whatever your stupid *** name is...don't state your comments when you don't know what the hell you are talking about, especially about me. You freaking noob...I was in the U.S. Army for 10+ years, so I think I know what I am talking about. Spoken like a childish little punk, as yourself.

Then you shoot with modern weapons that fires 5.56 highspeed ammo.
Even with this accurate weapons, it should not be as easy to make an
instantly headshot like at RO2.

From first day at RO2 beta i noticed the weapons are to accurate and
to easy to aim, even when you fire them while standing.
Show your head und you are dead in 0.5 seconds at any distance.
I
 
Upvote 0
One thing that became crystal clear to me today besides way too many smgs and assaults rifles is that

semi auto rifles dont have nearly enough recoil shooting them while in standing postition, its ludicrous how accurately and fast you can shoot them,

they shoot the same ammo as machine guns and have less recoil, its retarded
 
Upvote 0
They removed the artificial skill ceiling that insanely exaggerated recoil & sway were causing.

The mix of tactics & individual skill is still present, but the individual skill now plays a greater role.

Accordingly, RO1 vets are (mostly) getting utterly destroyed game after game by players who are just plain better.

This explains RO2 forums.

Now feed me that negative rep, i'll see you on the right side of the killspam messages :cool:
The only RO1 "vets" that are getting destroyed now are those whose idea of RO1 was prone camping on some irrelevant edge of the map for half a round. The actual good players of RO1 are still at top of the food chain, and many of them have the opinion that RO2 actually is less skill-dependent, due to its saturation with automatics, which have a very low skill ceiling.

Note that I'm not saying that we need more features to artificially gimp a player's abilities even more, but when it comes to automatics (even semis), OP does have a point, the near absence of recoil in combination with high damage makes them just too accessible and easy to use. In fact any random newcomer can just grab an MP-40 and be decent right off the bat, even in clan matches (for comparison: in ostfront you would see even good pub players join a clan and then have k/d like 1/12 in matches for a month). A respectable amount of (non-random, but controllable, with practice, think cs 1.6 style) recoil would go a long way towards not only balancing weapons but also leaving some room for skill progression.

So the bottom line is, OP has a good point that the game is just too easy to play, too accessible and mainstream, put it however you like. I don't agree with all he says (for example I think that low sway and zoom are good features), but it is true that the game rewards experience and skill significantly less than it could, due to it being very easy to play in just a "point and click" manner.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Quit comparing 1 with 2. There's a reason the RO1 server's are empty.

How to stop comparing a game with it predecessor?
Its RO2, not Battlefiel:RO.
And there is a reason why Battlefield:BC2 became a hardcore mode
and this servers are not empty.

I wont say TWI made a good job, till they split the weapons handlings
into more arcade and more realistic.
How to make a full game and then fail to do this?

Many newer games have two modes to fit both groups of players,
but RO2 just ignores all that RO1 did right and focus on kiddies only?

I was a very good player at RO1 with a high skill at each weapons and
tanks and for me, it feels like iam firing laser accurate rifles ar RO2.
One shoot one kill - that *****.
 
Upvote 0