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"What we are up to" - Feb 3rd edition

You manage to both state the obvious and miss the obvious at the exact same time.

I think you have a talent in the above, too. Like:

They have no control over most of that latency, however, which is the travel-time on the internet between clients and servers....

Yea.

But, regardless of any of that, there's still clearly something going on with the networking code that affects entire servers full of players, servers that should be able to handle the load (eg "the beast"), something that is not explainable as "natural to internet traffic." Something that needs to be fixed.
 
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The mode, while featuring no weapon or player upgrades or perks, will be ranked. So players who do enjoy receiving those upgrades and perks can play in this mode and earn them for the other modes. We feel this will allow players to experiment with the mode who might not normally play it, and feel rewarded for their play. Sounds good. Although just to add in I think upgrades should be able to be disabled/enabled by the player like COD's(Shutup members, I know i just compared RO to COD)weapon system where you get to choose what you like. Forcing 'upgrades' just doesn't feel right.

Loadouts and weapon availability will be more similar to what could be found in RO 1. Towards that end, the Squad Leader will be loosing his access to sub-machine guns and semi-automatic rifles to bring the ratio in line. The weapons selectable by each class will also more closely reflect that of RO 1 with PPSH w/ drum mag being the standard loadout and many of the other weapons not having access to their upgrades or limited to a specific upgrade (such as weapons with bayonets for that functionality)
Honestly I think it would be nice to let the squad leader choose if he/she wants a rifle or smg. In RO1 I always added bolts to the SL map loadout for variety(RO1 stock maps only gave smgs). I would prefer(My opinion) to have squad leaders be able to pick between rifle or smg depending on their needs.

This is the list we are currently looking at:
  • PPSH w/drum mag and select fire (Level 3)
  • Kar98 w/bayonet (Level 2)
  • Kar98 Sniper w/4X scope (Level 1)
  • Mosin Nagant Sniper w/3.5X scope (Level 1)
  • G41 Sniper w/4X Scope (Level 2)
  • SVT40 Sniper w/3.5X scope (Level 1)
  • MP40 with single 32 round mag (Level 1)
  • MKB42 with bayonet (no scope) (Level 1)
  • P38 Pistol (Level 1)
  • C96 w/10 round mag (Level 1)
  • MG34 w/50 round drum (Level 1)
  • MG34 Tripod (no ranking anyway)
  • PTRS (Level 1, no ranking on this anyway)
  • Pzb 784 (r) (Level 1, no ranking on this anyway)
  • MN 9130 w/bayonet (Level 2)
  • G41 (W) w/bayonet (Level 2)
  • SVT40 w/bayo (Level 3)
  • AVT40 w/bayo (Level 2)
  • TT33 (Level 1)
  • M1895 (Level 1)
  • DP28 (Level 1)
  • Maxim 1910 (no ranking anyway)
  • All other weapons and equipment as normally given (binocs, satchels, smoke nades, etc)

We are also looking at the inclusion of the Elite Assault role back into the game in case the creator of a map wants the MKB/AVT to be available.

But this wouldn't be a "RO Classic" mode with just weapon changes. We also have an initial list of functionality changes and removal as well. This list is designed to emulate the "feel" of RO 1 by making distance engagements a bit more of an uncertainty. You can find that list below. This is once again a look at the initial changes we are going to make for the mode and take feedback on in beta:

  • Removal of peripheral action indicators A good feature, I think it just needs to be adjusted so it can not be exploited.
  • Removal of spawn on Squad Leader Again I think this is a good feature however it could be refined. I understand it was not in RO1 but if it were refined so it were more reliable and cohesive, it would be a good thing to keep.

  1. Keep spawning tighter around squad leader. Less spawning behind enemy lines.
  2. Make it so when you select to spawn on squadleader, it won't spawn you on Spawn A/B/C if the timer runs out. Have it wait until spawn conditions are met.

  • Removal of the bleeding system (Player will always take 100% of the damage to an area on the shot and not half then bleed the rest out like in the current system) Again, not in RO1 but I feel it is a well intentioned feature. Same applies in RO2, good feature but needs refinement. The timers as they are now make it feel tacked on and gimmicky. Adjustment to timers combined/achieving synergy with wound system could possibly add to the gameplay without feeling arcade like or overly punishing.
  • Players will have a movement speed penalty after being shot in the feet. Good, does this apply to legs too or only feet?
  • Stamina will have a much greater effect on weapon sway and recoil.+
  • Stance will have an increased effect on weapon sway/recoil (with the default standing state having more sway then the current game modes)+
  • Removal of "controlled breathing" zoom, but retaining the functionality to help steady the weapon as well as the slight iron sight zoom. Sounds good, however Zetsumi brought up some good points for player choice.
  • Stamina will recharge at a slower rate
  • No AI Tank Gunnery Drivers are still in though I presume? That is an improvement over RO1 that should be kept.
  • No Lockdown I think I like this. Drawn out battles where players can turn the tide at the last minute is something that was missing from RO2.

As for people asking for bayonets and exiting tanks; I would like that too however animations require time and effort to create and I think we(more like TWI) should take some smaller steps before taking on a bigger challenge while there are other issues that need attention/give a bigger improvement for the least work. Not to mention adding more things can also open up a larger potential of creating bugs that could need fixing.
 
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How about those who want a realistic tactical ww2 shooter? Should we change games? :/

If TWI just keeps working on the existing modes than you won't get more realistic tactical shooter beacuse they have completely different view on what realism really is. In their opinion having prototype unique weapons in every team and ability to bandage yourself in few seconds is realistic.
It looks like they're unwiling to do this additional mode but forced beacuse actually so many people want that "real" historical realism, it was promised to us and should've been in the first place. Lot of us paid the money and never continued playing beacuse it wasn't a tactical ww2 shooter.
 
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To keep the ratio's similar to RO 1 we would have to remove the assault role completely to have the Squad Leaders retain access to sub-machine guns. Remember this is our first pass. It may not be the final solution we go with.

It may not be the final solution we go with.

the final solution

the final solution

I always suspected this of you Yoshiro, but now I finally have proof.

For shame.
 
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But, regardless of any of that, there's still clearly something going on with the networking code that affects entire servers full of players, servers that should be able to handle the load (eg "the beast"), something that is not explainable as "natural to internet traffic." Something that needs to be fixed.

You missed my point: even if they find some major bug that is causing massive overload on the server (And it turns out to be something other than "the server admin put the settings too high), then they're still only eliminating a tiny portion of the latency problem. And I should point out that it's unlikely to be the networking code that's overloading the server, but other parts of the code (You would not believe how many traces a single shot makes, particularly if it touches anything, and how many could just call the data already saved by a prior trace that appears to already be perfectly accessible. Or the number of scripting errors that are running the whole time the game is running that they simply suppressed the reporting of in the log).

I think people are overestimating how much of a difference it would make. They cry "fix the latency," but Tripwire can't do much about it. That was my entire point about if they managed to drop the turn-around time on the server to 0ms, there would still be problems. It would leave the core problem, that of having to deal with latency anyway, untouched. That was the entire point of what I was saying.
 
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Wow, I can't say how happy I am to read this OP. I started RO2 on launch day and saw how the leveling aspects worked and immediately quit the game (I assumed permanently). When I got in the game for the first time and realized that one of my favorite games of all time had been corrupted by the concept of persistent stats to detriment of realism (what I always believed RO was about) I was very sad. I know how much work and love went into this game and in any other case I would have come onto a game's forums to tell the developer how angry I was with them for making such a bad decesion, but I just uninstalled the game and hoped that one day something would change. I felt as if the purchase had been a complete waste of money, but you saying this now makes me feel as if I just pre-ordered an awesome new game I don't have access to yet.

I know at least 5 other people that felt the same way I do IRL, and I cannot wait to call them this morning (it's 1:30 am here now) and tell them aobut this (I know this is not new news, I'm only on the forum because whenever the game patches I came here in what I assumed was vain hope). Thanks so much Tripwire, you made my day (and its just started)!
 
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Since day 1 i have been waiting to come to the forums and see this post. I literally have tears in my eyes now, because i know that i am finally going to play more than 11hours on RO2 and FINALLY get my money's worth. Also, detachable bayonet, dont forget that...

I dont want to ruin a good mood but why was this not in at the beginning? Could you imagine how much this would have improved community relations? I'm guessing we'd also have at least an additional 500-1000 players that would have stuck around.

I wonder who at tripwire decided not to include this at launch. Whoever you are, i hope i encounter you one day in a dark alleyway and administer a sharp kick to your nuts.

Anyway, finally i can play this game...

ETA?
 
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One quick concern:

Hopefully this classic mode wont bring the recoil of all weapons back to level 1, in that case the mode will be useless for me personally. [...]

Well, as Yoshi said they will fix the weapons level at the following for the Classic Mode:

This is the list we are currently looking at:
  • PPSH w/drum mag and select fire (Level 3)
  • Kar98 w/bayonet (Level 2)
  • Kar98 Sniper w/4X scope (Level 1)
  • Mosin Nagant Sniper w/3.5X scope (Level 1)
  • G41 Sniper w/4X Scope (Level 2)
  • SVT40 Sniper w/3.5X scope (Level 1)
  • MP40 with single 32 round mag (Level 1)
  • MKB42 with bayonet (no scope) (Level 1)
  • P38 Pistol (Level 1)
  • C96 w/10 round mag (Level 1)
  • MG34 w/50 round drum (Level 1)
  • MG34 Tripod (no ranking anyway)
  • PTRS (Level 1, no ranking on this anyway)
  • Pzb 784 (r) (Level 1, no ranking on this anyway)
  • MN 9130 w/bayonet (Level 2)
  • G41 (W) w/bayonet (Level 2)
  • SVT40 w/bayo (Level 3)
  • AVT40 w/bayo (Level 2)
  • TT33 (Level 1)
  • M1895 (Level 1)
  • DP28 (Level 1)
  • Maxim 1910 (no ranking anyway)
  • All other weapons and equipment as normally given (binocs, satchels, smoke nades, etc)
 
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Well, I guess I will be passing it up then, cartoony recoil is not my thing :)
When Yoshiro is saying Level 3 after the weapons, I think he means the current upgrade level the weapon is at. E.G Level 3 PPSH has the drum mag, select fire and the handling of level 50. Only slightly confusing yes?
So turn around and get back here this instant! :D
 
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