Let's talk Versus!
- Thread starter Kittenmittens
- Start date
It'd be nice if before a human team starts a match, they choose the difficulty of the attacking zeds. The carrot for choosing HoE difficulty zeds would be a higher score... assuming they survive. Better yet would be a dynamic difficulty balancing system that increases difficulty/score automatically based on: player levels, mean time between zed spawn and death, and damage taken.
Right now, playing as ZEDs is like driving the fuel tanker in Battlefield Hardline pursuit mode (yes that game has one-hit-kill RPGs everywhere).
Right now, playing as ZEDs is like driving the fuel tanker in Battlefield Hardline pursuit mode (yes that game has one-hit-kill RPGs everywhere).
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Forgot, a way to play zeds in solo mode to get more used to them would be great, some of us have hundreeds of hours playing as survivors, getting to know every little detail about the controls and timing, on the other hand zeds have lower durability and you have little time to get used to them in depth.
Even against dummies would work.
Even against dummies would work.
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I rarely see humans win during the boss round.
I think the scoring system needs to be looked into.
I think an option to have a vote to end the game early if the second team gets past the part the previous team did would be interesting. A majority from both teams would be needed to end the game.
I think the scoring system needs to be looked into.
I think an option to have a vote to end the game early if the second team gets past the part the previous team did would be interesting. A majority from both teams would be needed to end the game.
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So any news on when you guys are going to start contacting people? Or have you already started?
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Honestly from what i've played, Pat's minigun needs serious nerf, it does way too much dmg even at extreme ranges.
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Versus is really fun, but it has a couple of fundamental flaws. One, it can get very unbalanced when there are high level players on the human team. Two, and perhaps more importantly, there's no incentive to play this mode. Playing as zeds may be fun as hell, but you don't gain any XP whatsoever. And since its always on normal difficulty, human players don't gain much XP either. I feel like this alone is why so few people play versus mode.
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played some more.
zeker regen that it's twice as stated is really noticeable in this mode, making incredibly dragged out games of cat and mice on certain scenarios.
scrake slow speed and short range that makes him easy in survival mode is a pain too as a zed, feels like the only way to hit a player is from behind/sides.
those two things negate a lot of thrill for both sides. in both survival and vs.
zeker regen that it's twice as stated is really noticeable in this mode, making incredibly dragged out games of cat and mice on certain scenarios.
scrake slow speed and short range that makes him easy in survival mode is a pain too as a zed, feels like the only way to hit a player is from behind/sides.
those two things negate a lot of thrill for both sides. in both survival and vs.
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I stopped playing versus after I achieved the achievements associated with it. And it can definitely screw off forever. Holy moly is this mode bad. Especially the boss fight, it drags for ages, it felt so bad. I had a very bad experience with this mode and I sure as hell not gonna touch it any longer. This game just is not made for this kind of stuff. It's a co-op game, you vs. the AI of Zeds, not bulletspongy crawlers on steriods or mad butchers without a job.
Especially the boss fight, wow, what a bad, dragged on experience I had with that. You can clearly tell that this should've stayed in prototype mode and never see the public.
Especially the boss fight, wow, what a bad, dragged on experience I had with that. You can clearly tell that this should've stayed in prototype mode and never see the public.
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I main 2 games at the moment. This game for PvE to calm down and another game for PvP to rage. I doubt I will ever play Versus Survival because it's PvP and I want to decrease my stress.
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TacticalSpy;n2283836 said:
Believe me, if you want to decrease your stress, never play Versus. My experience with this was so bad, it really has the exact opposite effect. The boss for example, it drags on, and on, and on, and on, and on. And on. But again, this game just is not made for PvP, it just isn't. And I always ask myself why Tripwire even bothered with this. Nobody on earth plays it. I got my achievements associated with it and that's it. Just thinking about this mode makes me shudder.
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Tell me if I'm wrong, but last time I played you can only do 4 waves and the other zeds are of normal difficulty, now to me I think that you should be able to up that , our group will play vs after the beta goes live and I'll let you know what we think.
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I don't play versus because the netcode is horide. I think dedicating ressources to versus is a waste of time, 99.999% of the playerbase is playing coop, just like in Left 4 Dead. Ppl playing versus are doing it for the achievement in KF2 
I don't see anything that would make versus more attractive, the Zeds are too OP in versus and the netcode is horide from what i have tried 70 vs 70-100 ping.
I don't see anything that would make versus more attractive, the Zeds are too OP in versus and the netcode is horide from what i have tried 70 vs 70-100 ping.
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Neuro75013;n2288409 said:I don't play versus because the netcode is horide. I think dedicating ressources to versus is a waste of time, 99.999% of the playerbase is playing coop, just like in Left 4 Dead. Ppl playing versus are doing it for the achievement in KF2
I don't see anything that would make versus more attractive, the Zeds are too OP in versus and the netcode is horide from what i have tried 70 vs 70-100 ping.
You obviously don't have any idea how big L4Ds versus scene was? There was even competitive scene for it. Versus could work in KF2, but not like this. The mode needs a lot of changes imo.
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Vi-Pe;n2288419 said:
I know that there was some competitions, doesn't mean what i said was wrong. i don't recall ever seen any stats on it but you can go to the custom server browser and check how many players play Versus mode and see how incredibly little does play it. I stand by what i've said, 99% of L4D2 players are playing coop. And as of KF2 it's more like 99,99%.
Yes L4D VS mode is realy nice but thats not the case with KF2's VS mode anyway. L4D has very good Special Infected that are nice to play, it's very different in KF2.
I think they should add wall jump for some Zeds etc.
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Those times I've played versus, when in zed side, death comes too quickly, it's not fun when playing zed. Scrake for example; he's in constant stumble mode, not fun when humans are shooting, you should be able swing the saw and charge --> FUN
Perhaps whole versus mode should be something else so that zeds got similar health levels as human players and the mechanics are not copied from co-op game (the f**king stumble for sc). Something like 8 humans vs 8 zeds, all commanded by real human players.
Perhaps whole versus mode should be something else so that zeds got similar health levels as human players and the mechanics are not copied from co-op game (the f**king stumble for sc). Something like 8 humans vs 8 zeds, all commanded by real human players.
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Based off of the old PvP but I'd say you have the same problems here. Normal difficulty with 4 waves and low AI zed count.
Also what Fox said; an objective. The most powerful weapon an fps gamer has is their focus, if they have no objective to focus on they can direct it entirely on the enemy team like a laser. If they have things to divide and redirect their attention it opens them up to opportunities for the zeds whereas right now (and before) zeds must create their own openings while trying not to die.
I don't know if you like hearing this but you need to look for L4D, specifically L4D2. They even have a developer commentary to show you their thought process behind things like why they chose certain abilities with the infected and their stages of balance etc.
Point being they certainly hhave what you want for this kind of PvP. Your game is nothing like it right now but some aspects of it really should be, namely survival versus. I'd recommend looking at that dev commentary for L4D2 as well as giving thought to how objectives would split player focus and create a more layered gamemode. It just gives another perspective and to be honest their PvP is really what yours should be if it's gonna be more fun.
Also what Fox said; an objective. The most powerful weapon an fps gamer has is their focus, if they have no objective to focus on they can direct it entirely on the enemy team like a laser. If they have things to divide and redirect their attention it opens them up to opportunities for the zeds whereas right now (and before) zeds must create their own openings while trying not to die.
I don't know if you like hearing this but you need to look for L4D, specifically L4D2. They even have a developer commentary to show you their thought process behind things like why they chose certain abilities with the infected and their stages of balance etc.
Point being they certainly hhave what you want for this kind of PvP. Your game is nothing like it right now but some aspects of it really should be, namely survival versus. I'd recommend looking at that dev commentary for L4D2 as well as giving thought to how objectives would split player focus and create a more layered gamemode. It just gives another perspective and to be honest their PvP is really what yours should be if it's gonna be more fun.
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I like the sound of adding an objective to VS. Maybe make it something simple but almost necessary to keep focus on VS and away from full blown objective with human-controlled zeds.
Just spitballing here, but maybe have there be only one ammo box on the map at a time and a human player has to find it and hold a "use" key for a short time to activate it. When activated the ammo box gives a normal amount of ammo to every human player in a radius. Keeps the humans together, removes one of them from combat for a short time, the others have to make sure they're within ammo box AoE range, keeps humans from camping the same spots always, and there's always a need to use it (at least for those of us that are OCD about being topped off).
As-is VS mode really points out how few modern multiplayer games focus on exclusively deathmatch/team deathmatch game modes and that mentioning of focus really makes a lot of sense. I currently hold no interest for VS mode whatsoever but the mere mentioning of adding objectives makes it sound much more enticing.
Just spitballing here, but maybe have there be only one ammo box on the map at a time and a human player has to find it and hold a "use" key for a short time to activate it. When activated the ammo box gives a normal amount of ammo to every human player in a radius. Keeps the humans together, removes one of them from combat for a short time, the others have to make sure they're within ammo box AoE range, keeps humans from camping the same spots always, and there's always a need to use it (at least for those of us that are OCD about being topped off).
As-is VS mode really points out how few modern multiplayer games focus on exclusively deathmatch/team deathmatch game modes and that mentioning of focus really makes a lot of sense. I currently hold no interest for VS mode whatsoever but the mere mentioning of adding objectives makes it sound much more enticing.
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I have a balance idea for versus, something i've been thinking about while remembering good old days.
Nerf pyro's dmg in versus only as it's quite OP for the gamemode.
Reduce health of player controlled zeds. Reason because in l4d2 versus player controlled zombies basically had same health pool as normal AI controlled special zombies which from player required a careful planing of how to approach the target.
Reduce player controlled zeds damage by a bit: honestly damage feels as if you're playing hoe especially from slasher.
Increase cooldown time for special moves: Again in l4d2 if you failed your attack you had to wait for it to recharge, in kf2 versus it's just a spam fest, fp rage at any time, puke at any time without any cooldown, pat spam rockets because he can, tbh that's too much.
You guys should really play a few game of l4d2 versus and implement some stuff from that game to balance out versus so it would be fair and fun, because as of now you can easily defeat survivors as player zeds do too much dmg and don't have any punishment of failing a special attack as it recharges too quickly.
Nerf pyro's dmg in versus only as it's quite OP for the gamemode.
Reduce health of player controlled zeds. Reason because in l4d2 versus player controlled zombies basically had same health pool as normal AI controlled special zombies which from player required a careful planing of how to approach the target.
Reduce player controlled zeds damage by a bit: honestly damage feels as if you're playing hoe especially from slasher.
Increase cooldown time for special moves: Again in l4d2 if you failed your attack you had to wait for it to recharge, in kf2 versus it's just a spam fest, fp rage at any time, puke at any time without any cooldown, pat spam rockets because he can, tbh that's too much.
You guys should really play a few game of l4d2 versus and implement some stuff from that game to balance out versus so it would be fair and fun, because as of now you can easily defeat survivors as player zeds do too much dmg and don't have any punishment of failing a special attack as it recharges too quickly.
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